beccatoria (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
beccatoria) wrote2011-03-16 06:12 pm
beccatoria) wrote2011-03-16 06:12 pm
Entry tags:
Fringe: Os
For those of you who even noticed I hadn't posted a write-up on this yet, the reason for its lateness is probably easily guessed - it wasn't that interesting.
The story of the week was fine, I guess. Mostly interesting in the way it illustrates our world's continued collapse and it did lead to some really nice stuff between Walter and Nina. I appreciate the kind of unexpected gentleness she shows him but the way she is very firm with it. Like from the previous episode when he asked her how she knew he wouldn't fail and she told him, "because you can't." Not angry, not glowing, just true and simple. He can't fail. I also liked, here, the focus on how yes, he is extremely intelligent, but that he was such a genius inventor because of his imagination; there was something simple, yet something I hadn't previously considered in the way she put that. For all he's lost parts of his brain to surgery and parts of his sanity to St Claire's, his imagination is intact, and Nina declares it the best part of him.
So, yes, I liked that.
The Peter/Olivia stuff was all...blah. Whatever. I mean, I didn't want to tear my eyes out, and okay, Olivia is a bit happier than we'd previously seen her but I felt she was still different to Fauxlivia and also, we saw her like this, a little, in the Pilot with John Scott and in the memories of him we saw later. So, okay. Fine. I don't get why she likes him but apparently she does and at least it seems reasonably low key (PAINFUL PAINFULLY forced expository dialogue from Walter to Nina aside). So I cringed slightly and eyerolled through it and figured, whatever, it could be worse. Mostly I'm offended by the perfunctory narrative way in which it was put together.
And I think that's where my sadness really comes in. Not so much at having to sit through a few brief scenes of her asking him if he wants to go to a street fair or something, but the way in which I do not get why they're together at all. I miss the scenes where she was quietly withdrawn and he was trying and failing to connect with her in clumsy ways. I miss the pain of that because it felt authentic in a way this doesn't, because I don't really feel the pain of that was ever resolved. It was resolved through Olivia's sheer determination not to be broken because Peter suggested to her that she was (which is interesting since I don't think, deep down, he wants to believe that at all). In itself, that's kind of heartbreaking too, but...I don't know anymore.
A lot hangs on how she handles the murderous revelation they ended with before William Bell took her over because in addition to general dishonesty, those 'shifters were pretty brutally killed.
So, okay, here's as simple as I can put it. In 6B Peter says he knows Olivia has trust issues and he never wanted to be one of the reasons for that. Yet he embarks on a relationship with her knowing he is continuing to deceive her in both a personal and professional capacity. How am I to take that?
He frames his admission to her in terms of trust in her judgement rather than an apology for his behaviour, which honestly, even if Peter isn't being willfully manipulative, still feels extremely manipulative. And it's not the first time he's flipped things around like this.
During the first half of the season I really thought that the problem was Peter didn't know Olivia as well as he thought; wanted to believe she was fixable and he was fixing her; loving her in spite of the parts of her that were broken and healed at slightly odd (if stronger) angles, instead of because of them. I think I clung to this interpretation so strongly because it was one in which my lack of understanding as to why the two of them had fallen for each other was a bonus not a negative. And because it was totally tragic, in the narrative sense of the word as well as the emotional. I even felt for Peter in this situation, who was, once again, unable to be the man this universe needed him to be.
But now, even though it was never what I wanted, I'm struggling not to see Peter as actively selfish. I don't think he sits around twirling his mustachios and wondering how he can manipulate Olivia, or anything. But I do think that he seems much more focused on how he can convince her to forgive him than whether or not she's ready to. It's not a perspective I want to hold, and until recently, it wasn't one I did hold.
And it may yet turn out that the machine has been affecting his behaviour in a myriad of ways and in some ways I hope it has been because he's becoming unlikeable in his search for answers. Which is ironically like his father(s), and something I applaud the show for doing if it is, indeed, doing it. But like so much on this show, I'm never sure.
I'm reminded of "Northwest Passage". That was the episode at the end of S2 when Peter went off on his own and had an adventure with Martha Plimpton as a local cop and Martha Plimpton owned the entire episode in absolutely stunning ways. And I went into that wondering if I'd come out of it understanding Peter more - wanting to. But the parts of Peter I came to understand more were not really the parts I wanted to. The isolation and abandonment and confusion I wanted to see explored were pretty much entirely sublimated beneath a veneer of casual interpersonal surface-interactions and, once engaged in something he thought could provide him with answers, in righteous, singleminded anger and resolve to the point he became more than a little disturbing.
At the time I mourned not getting to see what was underneath the anger, because I kind of vaguely assumed the anger was shorthand for Action!Peter and the episode was yet another failed attempt to make him seem edgy and cool and like a Lead Character, instead of being braver and going for something quieter and more introspective.
But I'm starting to think that the confusion and isolation has been pushed so deep down in Peter for so long that the episode might have given me more insight into Peter than I realised at first. His inability to form really deep and lasting connections to people manifest in questionable behaviour even with those he wants to form bonds with. He gets aggressive and angry when he's frustrated. And he's kind of selfish and singleminded to the point of tunnelvision when he's decided that there's something he wants - like answers about his background or the machine.
His broken childhood makes these traits make sense. More than that, they're traits that Walter and Walternate share very strongly. I know that's a negative slew of crap I just dumped on him; probably slightly more extreme than he deserves, but I'm trying to illustrate a point. Which is, Peter's...not really that great a guy all the time. And there's a bunch of interesting backstory reasons for that if we care to delve into them, and a bunch of potentially interesting narrative things that could be done with that in the future, the problem is that once again, am I seeing what I'm supposed to be seeing?
Peter was introduced as a conman, but fandom latched onto him as the conman with a heart ofPacey gold. And it's not that I think he has a heart of PURE EVIL ICE or anything, I just wonder how much of the assumption that he's a real Nice Guy in a Crazy Situation is fannish creation, show intention or Dawson's Creek transference.
I certainly think a fair amount does come from the show's seemingly ambivalent attitude to him and its failure to really give him enough space to develop into a character complex enough to encompass both the Nice Guy in a Crazy Situation and the Angry Guy who Wants Answers and Doesn't Care How He Gets Them. Which is totally doable, but just...hasn't been done for him, in my mind.
Ultimately I guess it's just...he's making me uncomfortable. He's reminding me of Walternate. I hope this is intentional. I hope Olivia gives him hell about this. I hope it was largely down to the Machine affecting him because otherwise I think I'm going to struggle with what I think of him.
Mostly I just hope that they don't handle it the way they handled Olivia's feelings after she found out about Peter and Fauxlivia - i.e. setting up a complicated, painful, real situation, then resolving it because "it's been a while, let's resolve it" rather than because any common ground actually seemed to have been reached.
The story of the week was fine, I guess. Mostly interesting in the way it illustrates our world's continued collapse and it did lead to some really nice stuff between Walter and Nina. I appreciate the kind of unexpected gentleness she shows him but the way she is very firm with it. Like from the previous episode when he asked her how she knew he wouldn't fail and she told him, "because you can't." Not angry, not glowing, just true and simple. He can't fail. I also liked, here, the focus on how yes, he is extremely intelligent, but that he was such a genius inventor because of his imagination; there was something simple, yet something I hadn't previously considered in the way she put that. For all he's lost parts of his brain to surgery and parts of his sanity to St Claire's, his imagination is intact, and Nina declares it the best part of him.
So, yes, I liked that.
The Peter/Olivia stuff was all...blah. Whatever. I mean, I didn't want to tear my eyes out, and okay, Olivia is a bit happier than we'd previously seen her but I felt she was still different to Fauxlivia and also, we saw her like this, a little, in the Pilot with John Scott and in the memories of him we saw later. So, okay. Fine. I don't get why she likes him but apparently she does and at least it seems reasonably low key (PAINFUL PAINFULLY forced expository dialogue from Walter to Nina aside). So I cringed slightly and eyerolled through it and figured, whatever, it could be worse. Mostly I'm offended by the perfunctory narrative way in which it was put together.
And I think that's where my sadness really comes in. Not so much at having to sit through a few brief scenes of her asking him if he wants to go to a street fair or something, but the way in which I do not get why they're together at all. I miss the scenes where she was quietly withdrawn and he was trying and failing to connect with her in clumsy ways. I miss the pain of that because it felt authentic in a way this doesn't, because I don't really feel the pain of that was ever resolved. It was resolved through Olivia's sheer determination not to be broken because Peter suggested to her that she was (which is interesting since I don't think, deep down, he wants to believe that at all). In itself, that's kind of heartbreaking too, but...I don't know anymore.
A lot hangs on how she handles the murderous revelation they ended with before William Bell took her over because in addition to general dishonesty, those 'shifters were pretty brutally killed.
So, okay, here's as simple as I can put it. In 6B Peter says he knows Olivia has trust issues and he never wanted to be one of the reasons for that. Yet he embarks on a relationship with her knowing he is continuing to deceive her in both a personal and professional capacity. How am I to take that?
He frames his admission to her in terms of trust in her judgement rather than an apology for his behaviour, which honestly, even if Peter isn't being willfully manipulative, still feels extremely manipulative. And it's not the first time he's flipped things around like this.
During the first half of the season I really thought that the problem was Peter didn't know Olivia as well as he thought; wanted to believe she was fixable and he was fixing her; loving her in spite of the parts of her that were broken and healed at slightly odd (if stronger) angles, instead of because of them. I think I clung to this interpretation so strongly because it was one in which my lack of understanding as to why the two of them had fallen for each other was a bonus not a negative. And because it was totally tragic, in the narrative sense of the word as well as the emotional. I even felt for Peter in this situation, who was, once again, unable to be the man this universe needed him to be.
But now, even though it was never what I wanted, I'm struggling not to see Peter as actively selfish. I don't think he sits around twirling his mustachios and wondering how he can manipulate Olivia, or anything. But I do think that he seems much more focused on how he can convince her to forgive him than whether or not she's ready to. It's not a perspective I want to hold, and until recently, it wasn't one I did hold.
And it may yet turn out that the machine has been affecting his behaviour in a myriad of ways and in some ways I hope it has been because he's becoming unlikeable in his search for answers. Which is ironically like his father(s), and something I applaud the show for doing if it is, indeed, doing it. But like so much on this show, I'm never sure.
I'm reminded of "Northwest Passage". That was the episode at the end of S2 when Peter went off on his own and had an adventure with Martha Plimpton as a local cop and Martha Plimpton owned the entire episode in absolutely stunning ways. And I went into that wondering if I'd come out of it understanding Peter more - wanting to. But the parts of Peter I came to understand more were not really the parts I wanted to. The isolation and abandonment and confusion I wanted to see explored were pretty much entirely sublimated beneath a veneer of casual interpersonal surface-interactions and, once engaged in something he thought could provide him with answers, in righteous, singleminded anger and resolve to the point he became more than a little disturbing.
At the time I mourned not getting to see what was underneath the anger, because I kind of vaguely assumed the anger was shorthand for Action!Peter and the episode was yet another failed attempt to make him seem edgy and cool and like a Lead Character, instead of being braver and going for something quieter and more introspective.
But I'm starting to think that the confusion and isolation has been pushed so deep down in Peter for so long that the episode might have given me more insight into Peter than I realised at first. His inability to form really deep and lasting connections to people manifest in questionable behaviour even with those he wants to form bonds with. He gets aggressive and angry when he's frustrated. And he's kind of selfish and singleminded to the point of tunnelvision when he's decided that there's something he wants - like answers about his background or the machine.
His broken childhood makes these traits make sense. More than that, they're traits that Walter and Walternate share very strongly. I know that's a negative slew of crap I just dumped on him; probably slightly more extreme than he deserves, but I'm trying to illustrate a point. Which is, Peter's...not really that great a guy all the time. And there's a bunch of interesting backstory reasons for that if we care to delve into them, and a bunch of potentially interesting narrative things that could be done with that in the future, the problem is that once again, am I seeing what I'm supposed to be seeing?
Peter was introduced as a conman, but fandom latched onto him as the conman with a heart of
I certainly think a fair amount does come from the show's seemingly ambivalent attitude to him and its failure to really give him enough space to develop into a character complex enough to encompass both the Nice Guy in a Crazy Situation and the Angry Guy who Wants Answers and Doesn't Care How He Gets Them. Which is totally doable, but just...hasn't been done for him, in my mind.
Ultimately I guess it's just...he's making me uncomfortable. He's reminding me of Walternate. I hope this is intentional. I hope Olivia gives him hell about this. I hope it was largely down to the Machine affecting him because otherwise I think I'm going to struggle with what I think of him.
Mostly I just hope that they don't handle it the way they handled Olivia's feelings after she found out about Peter and Fauxlivia - i.e. setting up a complicated, painful, real situation, then resolving it because "it's been a while, let's resolve it" rather than because any common ground actually seemed to have been reached.
no subject
Aww, they were so sweet! I'm beginning to love anything about Nina too. She's such an intriguing woman and I'm so curious about her!
For all he's lost parts of his brain to surgery and parts of his sanity to St Claire's, his imagination is intact, and Nina declares it the best part of him.
Yes. :-) I like him better because he's fallable and not always confident but with a bit of support his imagination carries the day. I hadn't thought of that way, either but it's a great way to think about it.
Mostly I'm offended by the perfunctory narrative way in which it was put together.
I'm just glad it's not so overt and not out-and-out bad, you know? I think of Olivia as an acquaintance I see frequently but don't know very well. I may not get why she dates who she dates but I'm really grateful if she doesn't talk to me too much about it.
I do think that he seems much more focused on how he can convince her to forgive him than whether or not she's ready to.
Ooh! I think I'm learning something here. See, I'm not angry with Peter. I'm annoyed with the writers. It seems in the middle of seasons, they sideline Olivia. What's happening here is this romance is more focused on Peter than on Olivia's needs. I saw the little charge Nina got when she saw that Peter had picked Olivia, therefore picking this universe. But no!!! It's not frakking about what Peter chooses or his forgiveness or his whatever. It's about what you say here. About Olivia and how she's healed and why and her choices.
I don't blame Peter (who reminded me oddly and uncomfortably of Anakin Skywalker killing the Tusken Raiders in Episode 2 here) but if the show puts him at the forefront, then what can he do? He's being allowed to be selfish. Simply put, they could write him better here. And that's a lot for me to say considering I don't like the actor. But for once, I don't think it's Joshua Jackons here. It's a writing thing.
But like so much on this show, I'm never sure.
I still dislike Pacey but not any more than before. I feel a bit of sympathy because he was prepared to love this Olivia and then they fucked with him and he fell for the alternate. And if he doesn't become 'mechanized' or do something then he's just helplessly waiting for stuff to happen to him. Which is where they all were before.
As for the show, I don't think they've forgotten Olivia. That was the thing about listening to DVD comments. They totally plan to get back to Olivia. I just don't know why it takes so loooooooooong.
no subject
Ahahahaa, hilarious. Yes, I understand what you mean. I think for me I think of her as a friend who I do know very well so it upsets me that I don't get why she dates who she dates and I worry that it's a bad choice, but at least she's not asking me to hang out with them too. ;)
See, I'm not angry with Peter. I'm annoyed with the writers. It seems in the middle of seasons, they sideline Olivia. What's happening here is this romance is more focused on Peter than on Olivia's needs.
I'm...not 100% sure I agree with you though I definitely understand why you think the way you do. I feel more like I'm genuinely unsure what they're doing because I don't feel it's that focused on Peter's needs either? Because I do think that 6B when Olivia decides to give it a go again is very much rooted in her perspective and gives a fairly realistic journey for her to go through to get to the point she does at the end. The problem I have is that I find it realistic because Olivia is the kind of person who sucks it up and just accepts she's going to have to do all the legwork which breaks my heart.
So what worries me is that the writers think that I ought to genuinely see it as a positive and understandable development, which I think is probably the case. But they are still writing it from Olivia's perspective, to me. WHICH IS WHY I'M SO CONFUSED. It's less that I think they're making it about Peter and more like I think they're making it about Olivia's needs but then writing that weirdly? I hope that makes sense...? Or like, they're making it about Olivia's needs but they haven't yet explained to me why she needs to be with Peter?
As to the ultimate choice in the machine - as a separate issue I'm not convinced either Universe will be destroyed since they've said that they're not writing it as a series finale and are proceeding with the hope of getting a fourth season. So I don't think they'd destroy a universe, which means I'm not sure the whole Peter's Choice thing will play out the way we fear it will; what remains to be seen is whether it'll play out in a way that disavows the ickiness of what they set up, which I think is possible but not assured.
I don't blame Peter (who reminded me oddly and uncomfortably of Anakin Skywalker killing the Tusken Raiders in Episode 2 here)
AHAHAHAHAHAHA. Genius and hilarious comparison.