I was more aware of the politics because I've lived in Wales most of my life, but my mother is actually American so UK/US cultural difference ping me more. The first issue opens with Snow refusing to help Beauty and the Beast by paying for marriage counseling so he can look human again and avoid moving to the farm, and says they can't afford it but if they could she wouldn't do it because they're not like the mundanes and don't look to the government to solve their problems and attitudes to the social state is another of those transatlantic culture shock issues.
I'm not sure this is a point at which I'd say that Snow is expressing views typical of heroines I like, but I do very much empathise with falling in love with the sorts of women who will use the power given them or that they've managed to claim, even if the power structures are problematic simply because claiming their place within them becomes revolutionary. Regarding Laura Roslin, I was...so frustrated with that storyline mainly because I felt it was stupid. Baltar gave nonsensical reasons. And if they'd managed to give sensible reasons, and still had my (at the time) favourite fictional character doing something I found ethically abhorrent, and she found ethically abhorrent, man, that would have been amazing and complicated and a sharp look at the dangers of democracy despite it being the best option we have because at that point, I would have turned around and voted for Baltar too.
But as you say: WOULD THAT THAT WERE OUR GREATEST QUARREL WITH THAT SHOW.
Regarding the Arabian Fables, yeah, there's a difference between the structure of their inclusion and the individual execution of it. Although I did enjoy Sinbad for the most part - I thought his eeeeeeevil caricature of an adviser was far more concerning, though it's an area I don't feel I'm educated enough in all the various stereotypes and tropes to really comment comprehensively on? I did wonder, while reading it, what I would make of it if I were more familiar with the crap that tends to go with Western attitudes to Arabian culture. Along those lines, I have to confess, the issues around Scheherezade in 1001 Nights of Snowfall actually went right over my head as I never had anything more than a very, very passing familiarity with her, and so I clocked that the entire concept of recasting Snow in the role was potentially problematic, but not quite the degree to which Scheherezade was a fairly radically feminist figure in her own story. I googled her before replying, however, and think I get it a bit better now. :(
Regarding the overwhelming whiteness of the Fabletown population, I think I would have been okay with that (given they do clarify that there are many homelands, often tied to the nations that originally told their stories in the mundy world) if only the author had included more of the other fable communities in the story, but that never really happens, even after their treaty with the Arabian Fables.
I agree with you that Once Upon A Time and Fables are very different. I also at the moment agree that Fables is better, although I think they're doing some significantly different things and I'm not quite sure that Once is attempting to deconstruct in the same way that - at least early Fables - quite clearly had as a goal? I...have very unformed thoughts on this that I wish would form better so that I could make a post about them. :/
Re: Willingham: I didn't know he said that and yes, Ugh. My decision to find out nothing about him definitely appears to be the correct one.
I TRIED to watch the Vampire Diaries once and failed! But it was just a random episode that was on TV and I didn't understand what was going on... But I will definitely take any analogy over Supernatural! :p
Hope you enjoy the Totenkinder post whenever you get a chance to get around to it. :)
(Also - meant to reply to your other comment this evening but have run out of time! Hopefully tomorrow!)
![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
no subject
Date: 2012-03-04 11:59 pm (UTC)I was more aware of the politics because I've lived in Wales most of my life, but my mother is actually American so UK/US cultural difference ping me more. The first issue opens with Snow refusing to help Beauty and the Beast by paying for marriage counseling so he can look human again and avoid moving to the farm, and says they can't afford it but if they could she wouldn't do it because they're not like the mundanes and don't look to the government to solve their problems and attitudes to the social state is another of those transatlantic culture shock issues.
I'm not sure this is a point at which I'd say that Snow is expressing views typical of heroines I like, but I do very much empathise with falling in love with the sorts of women who will use the power given them or that they've managed to claim, even if the power structures are problematic simply because claiming their place within them becomes revolutionary. Regarding Laura Roslin, I was...so frustrated with that storyline mainly because I felt it was stupid. Baltar gave nonsensical reasons. And if they'd managed to give sensible reasons, and still had my (at the time) favourite fictional character doing something I found ethically abhorrent, and she found ethically abhorrent, man, that would have been amazing and complicated and a sharp look at the dangers of democracy despite it being the best option we have because at that point, I would have turned around and voted for Baltar too.
But as you say: WOULD THAT THAT WERE OUR GREATEST QUARREL WITH THAT SHOW.
(Oh also yes: oldskool wedding vows = whut & ick, Snow, whut & ick.)
Regarding the Arabian Fables, yeah, there's a difference between the structure of their inclusion and the individual execution of it. Although I did enjoy Sinbad for the most part - I thought his eeeeeeevil caricature of an adviser was far more concerning, though it's an area I don't feel I'm educated enough in all the various stereotypes and tropes to really comment comprehensively on? I did wonder, while reading it, what I would make of it if I were more familiar with the crap that tends to go with Western attitudes to Arabian culture. Along those lines, I have to confess, the issues around Scheherezade in 1001 Nights of Snowfall actually went right over my head as I never had anything more than a very, very passing familiarity with her, and so I clocked that the entire concept of recasting Snow in the role was potentially problematic, but not quite the degree to which Scheherezade was a fairly radically feminist figure in her own story. I googled her before replying, however, and think I get it a bit better now. :(
Regarding the overwhelming whiteness of the Fabletown population, I think I would have been okay with that (given they do clarify that there are many homelands, often tied to the nations that originally told their stories in the mundy world) if only the author had included more of the other fable communities in the story, but that never really happens, even after their treaty with the Arabian Fables.
I agree with you that Once Upon A Time and Fables are very different. I also at the moment agree that Fables is better, although I think they're doing some significantly different things and I'm not quite sure that Once is attempting to deconstruct in the same way that - at least early Fables - quite clearly had as a goal? I...have very unformed thoughts on this that I wish would form better so that I could make a post about them. :/
Re: Willingham: I didn't know he said that and yes, Ugh. My decision to find out nothing about him definitely appears to be the correct one.
I TRIED to watch the Vampire Diaries once and failed! But it was just a random episode that was on TV and I didn't understand what was going on... But I will definitely take any analogy over Supernatural! :p
Hope you enjoy the Totenkinder post whenever you get a chance to get around to it. :)
(Also - meant to reply to your other comment this evening but have run out of time! Hopefully tomorrow!)