beccatoria: (anakin solo tears from a star)
[personal profile] beccatoria
So, after yesterdays srs post about srs bizness (well day before yesterday now, cus it's after midnight), I thought I'd post something fun. Again, I am inflicting Star Wars on my flist so if you are not interested, look away now! Or just skip to the picture of the pretty man at the end too many pictures already; will save pretty picspam for another day. :)

A while back a forum I frequent held a "Top 100 EU Works," poll, where everyone was welcome to submit their top 20 EU Works (be that novel, radio drama, comic, sourcebook, cartoon, video game, non-OT or PT movie...whatever) and then a top 100 would be compiled by the moderators. (Yes, there is just that much EU material).

So in case you're interested in what kind of Star Wars fan I am - I present to you, my list! Along with the end ranking of the work according to the TF.N forums. I've tried to pick a combination of my personal favourites, the ones I think are the best objectively, and the ones I think do important things for the EU, or show its breadth. I wanted the list to be...representative of what I like about the EU.

So: In REVERSE ORDER!


20. Shadows of the Empire (novel) - Steve Perry
TF.N ranking - 15.

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Note the way the Emperor's checking out Luke's ass in the picture.

It's been a long time since I read this but I still recall its clever use of continuity. I remember being skeptical of how much a book set between the films could interest me - of how much could happen - and being proved wrong. Great characterisation and I found myself caring about the set-up for Return of the Jedi more than I ever knew I would. Plus again, a book that makes use of the seedy underside of the galaxy that's too often ignored both before and after the Original Trilogy movies despite the fact that they so firmly establish it. It seems that once we get abundant Jedi, the material that gets cut are the smugglers and pirates. But at this point, the only Force-users we have are Darth Vader - murderous and cunning - Luke, still coming to terms with the revelation of his parentage - Leia, who's latent talent-hints I loved - and the Emperor. And that's enough. And the rest of the story flourishes. And for once, Lando gets some attention. Err...from an author that is. I kind of assume that when he's not "on-page" he's always getting some attention... ;)


19. X-Wing: Starfighters of Adumar (novel) - Aaron Allston
TF.N ranking - 13.

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What the hell kind of a name is "Wedge" anyway?

Come on! Who doesn't love a book where you get those magnificent Rogues in their flying machines AND sword fighting?! It's camp. It's fun. It's funny. It has a woman using a disembodied head as a camera. It has great action, and it even manages to make a couple of serious points along the way about the way idealistic organisations tend to start behaving once they've become legitimate governments. Plus somebody gets the girl. That's always something to cheer for. Especially when they do it while speaking like something out of a 1950s movie!


18. I, Jedi (novel) - Michael Stackpole
TF.N ranking - 20.

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I swear, Corran, I have been waiting for you to rescue me for FOUR MONTHS, what the HELL is the HOLD UP!

Come on! Who doesn't love Corran Horn? Brave use of perspective, and a great story. I don't have a lot to say on this one, not because I don't like it but because the reasons I like it are simple. It expands the galaxy and the cast of characters. It's well written and deals well with topics like the dark side and temptation. And because, in my opinion, Stackpole does better with Anderson's plot than Anderson did. Plus the idea of setting it during the Jedi Academy Trilogy is interesting in itself.


17. The New Jedi Order: Enemy Lines duology (novel duology) - Aaron Allston
TF.N ranking - 16.

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Okay, I probably ought to use an illustration that shows her flying X-Wings or flirting with Imperials since that's what she spends most of this book doing, but LOOK, she's fighting a giant LIZARD!

Fantastic chance for Jaina to shine. I loved the crazy plot to turn her into a Goddess and all the tactics and strategies for the space battles. The Lusankya's final battle was brilliant as was the chance to see the old Rogues and Wraiths. The adventure with Lord Nyax was slightly campy but forgiven for the chance it gave us to get our first glimpse at Vong-formed Coruscant which added a sense of the epic this series deserved. Just as great was the chance to see our heroes once again fighting as the Rebellion against a superior force, using guts and brains to beat them. Aaah, nostalgia! On top of that, there's Lando leading legions of war droids and bitching he's tool old for this kind of crap. And Viqi Shesh, your death was...perfect for you!

In all, Allston crafted a fantastic action-adventure piece that captured a lot of the Original Trilogy's feel while staying true to the dark roots of the NJO's setting. For that, it deserves to be on this list. Certainly in terms of pure "WHOOP!" enjoyment, it was the best series within the NJO.


16. The New Jedi Order: Edge of Victory duology (novel duology) - Greg Keyes
TF.N ranking - 24.

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What? It's a great picture of Anakin and Tahiri. Just ignore that...rabbit thing.

Another great NJO duology. The Anakin emerging here and in Dark Tide is the reason his death in Star By Star is so tragic. Keyes captures that perfect combination of youth and bravery, fear and fearlessness, and it makes Anakin great. The beginnings of his romance with Tahiri are similarly treated lightly and innocently but also very seriously. We can never forget how young they both are, or how earnest.

On top of that, we get a fantastic Vong subplot with Nen Yim, and another great non-Movie-or-child-of-Movie-character arc with Tahiri and her capture and the starts of her recovery.


15. Star Wars: Clone Wars Volume II (cartoon) - Genndy Tartakovsky
For clarity I mean Season Three (according to Wooki), though the DVD was released as Volume II I think. The slighly longer final five episodes (21 - 25).
TF.N ranking - unrated.

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I couldn't find a picture of his actual vision quest, so instead you can have him drugged up, semi-limbless and leading an army of obese trolls.

All the greatness of the entire Clone Wars cartoon - the fantastic action and animation style that made it just plain fun along with a great build-up to Revenge of the Sith. And best of all, the way it starts to introduce some darkness and forboding. I love Anakin's "vision quest". It was very simple but surprisingly affecting when the cave-painting of the boy with the mechanical arm, first using it to defend everything, and then having his mechanical arm turn on all the people he loved and start eating them. I sort of felt, at that moment, I really never needed to see the details of Vader's creation. And I liked the callback to "more machine, now, than man."


14. Revenge of the Sith (movie novelisation) - Matthew Stover
TF.N ranking - 1.

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OH MY GOD, YOU KILLED SHAAK TI, YOU BASTARDS!
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OH MY GOD, YOU DID IT AGAIN! Make up your minds...

Note: Above images used because, while neither appears in the final cut of the film or the book, I refuse to use any images of anything that did appear in that piece of crap movie. So why is the novelisation up there? Allow me to explain...

I was bitterly disappointed by the film. Anakin came across as whiny, Padme as useless, Obi-Wan as blind to the obvious. Restoring the cut scenes and adding such great writing saved much. The slow erosion of Anakin's trust becomes clearer. Padme really is lying to him and hiding things. Because she's off forming the Rebellion rather than being useless. Obi-Wan's love of his 'brother' Anakin feels ten-times realer than the movie. And Palpatine's manipulations are far more eloquent than, "Hey, guess what, there's this myth about this dude who can save your wife's life!" From the point at the start where Stover turns the staple, "a long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away..." into a prison; a lock-in for tragedy because it has all already happened and we cannot change it, to the end, where we see Vader waking up in his armour, so much more elegantly expressed than the film's cartoonish, "NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO," this book excels.

I think what's truly incredible is how much it improves on its source.

"You can hear yourself breathing. It comes hard, and harsh, and it scrapes nerves already raw, but you cannot stop it. You can never stop it. You cannot even slow it down."

Awesome.


13. Knights of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords (video game) - Obsidian Entertainment
TF.N ranking - 20.

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In my head, Atris and Nihilus are as awesome as this picture leads me to believe...

I feel guilty including this game when I'm not including the first game which was far superior in terms of...well, everything to do with being a computer game, and also had a great plot. But while I don't feel I can include this game further up the list because it's so...flawed, it does have a number of really, really important things in it. And in terms of advancing the mythology of the galaxy, it really does, I think, do more than the first game.

I love this game because it introduces us to who you are being more important than what you can do with the Force. Because it shows you that you can walk away from power and that it needn't destroy or define you. Because the conflict between the Exile who walked away from religion and Kreia who wants to destroy religion is incredible.

Because it deals with the Jedi being afraid of change; because it dares to cast them as villains.

Because I like the elegiac quality of the trashed universe and a bunch of people suffering from post-traumatic stress-disorder trying not to go mad dealing with it.

And because it might be due to designer laziness but I'm fascinated by the fact that light or dark choices in the game really doesn't make much difference to the plot. You still get the same ending. It's utterly nihilistic, really. The message of the game seems to be, you can choose to be a good person or a bad person, but the ultimate conflict isn't between light and dark, it's between existence and nothingness.

Conceptually, it's massive. And I'm still irked that it wasn't better explored. I wish it had been a novel. That would have ruled.


12. Legacy of the Force: Betrayal (novel) - Aaron Allston
TF.N ranking - 17.

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Oh, he's so ambiguous. FEAR his ambiguity!

This book is full of a wonderful sense of forthcoming doom as both Jacen and Luke are swept up in visions of the future, evershifting and tantalising and frightening. Ben's character is strong and interesting. Everyone gets a chance to get in on the action and the conflict is, if not entirely organic, at least impressive in terms of the way it splits families without providing a clear enemy. Corellia is behaving like a spoiled kid and Thracken is as villainous as ever, but Han has a point. That if there's no room to change, to be anarchic, to be the free-wheeling Alliance the GFFA was originally conceived as, then they've failed somehow. Then they've lost something. And Jacen, still treading a fine line until the end, when he makes a sudden and brutal decision. It's a great start. The rest doesn't always live up to it.


11. The Thrawn Trilogy (novel trilogy) - Timothy Zahn
TF.N ranking - 2.

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You and me, baby, we ain't nothing but mammals...

First EU I ever read, and I never looked back. Great new characters in Mara, Karrde and Thrawn. Great continuation of the characters of Luke, Han and Leia. Add to the traditional Star Wars adventure space-opera spirit the new twists of political intrigue and scheming plot and masterful tactics. It's one of the few stories that really involves the smuggling underbelly of the universe and gives us a villainous but not purely evil Empire. If nothing else, it earns a place on this list for what it started. If not for this series and its successes I doubt that the EU would have been given the chance it was or have been the success it is.


10. Star Wars Tales: Unseen, Unheard (comic) - Chris Avellone
TF.N ranking - unrated.

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You rang?

Six pages that saved Nihilus for me. Great art, simple story, hollow and terrifying villain. I'm still not sure I understand the meaning of the last line. But this story moved Nihilus from under-developed and poorly constructed computer-game villain to someone as frightening as Vader when he first walked onto the Tantive IV.


9. The Last One Standing: the Tale of Boba Fett (short story) - Daniel Keys Moran
TF.N ranking - 28.

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No, seriously, I'm so hard, after I escaped from the Sarlacc, I went back and did it again.

I read it when I was thirteen, the summer after I saw the Original Trilogy movies for the first time. I was disinterested in Fett and expected to be bored by the story. I wasn't. It was my first introduction to the notion that Star Wars stories needn't be written as I expected - straightforward adventure plots like the novels I'd read - and greatly enjoyed - previously. This was...different. This was a story of a man dying slowly. This was a story about growing old - which, odd as it seems considering it was a story about old men, and I was barely a teenaged girl - seemed oddly germane at that time in my life, as I was trying to work out what growing up and growing older entailed. And eventually the whole story came down to two men, wounded, lost, unable to retreat, or attack. Just...there. Just standing. With words set my mind on fire.

It was a story where I cared about the ending more than any other story in a very long time. And I got there...and there was nothing. Just the impossibility of...everything. And I went, "What?! That's it?" And then I went, "Right. I guess that's it." And then I went and read bits of it to my mother. Even though she had no idea who Boba Fett was, and cared even less.


8. Legacy: Broken (comic) - John Ostrander & Jan Duursema
TF.N ranking - 7.

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OT3. Except Jariah's in love with Cade's mom.

Great art, great story, great characterisation. A real, keen understanding of the Star Wars universe. Smugglers, princesses, Empires, Jedi, Sith, poison, pirates, torture, sword-fights, life and death, good guys, bad guys, kissing, miracles, adventure and true love. Well, okay, not the last one; yet. And it's not The Princess Bride, though I love it just as much. It gives you everything you expect in the last configuration you possibly expect.


7. Knights of the Old Republic: Commencement (comic) - John Jackson MIller
TF.N ranking - 27.

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Because who doesn't want a space girl to fly in and rescue you using your own lightsaber at the last possible moment?

I say most of what I want to say about this series in the entry to come, but to sum up - humour, horror and heroism. Zayne is a wonderful character and it's great to laugh while reading a comic. Even more brilliant to laugh one minute and have your breath catch in your throat the next. Miller throws in philosophical dilemmas smoothly and confuses moral boundries without ever confusing heroism.

Lucien: Respect the vision, fear what you may become.
Zayne: I can't. Fear leads to the dark side - doesn't it, Master.


6. Dark Times: The Path to Nowhere (comic) - Mick Harrison
TF.N ranking - 55.

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Damn, that's one extreme hair dryer.

This gives us a surprisingly broken and thoughtful Vader. I loved the apparently forgotten callback to young Anakin's dream that he freed all the slaves. More than that I found the brutality of the story oddly...appropriate? Had I heard about the plotline rather than reading it, I think I would have been unimpressed; figured it'd play out as gratuitous. But it works well. Not so much in terms of Bomo's character - there it's a functional but unsubtle hammer to the gut; his daughter got bought by a slaver who killed and ate her - but in terms of Jennir's. The story really illustrates the appropriateness of the "Dark Times," moniker. Not because no Jedi has ever had to make tough choices but just because...somehow...this comic makes the universe feel wrong, unbalanced. As if the universe would never have put Dass Jennir in such a position before the Empire, even if it had technically, literally, been possible. His decision to shoot the villain of the piece to prevent Bomo from taking revenge seems perfectly, bluntly placed. Both a major turning point, and one that seems - at that point - to be almost meaningless. Such a quiet change of course. And obviously, there's the artwork too. Doug Wheatley is amazing. And the image of Jennir's face in issue 4 when he chooses to shoot his informant is...well, it'll stay with me a really long time. (See above).


5. Knights of the Old Republic: Days of Fear (comic) - John Jackson Miller
TF.N ranking - 68.

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Zayne was well-happy with his new Sodom and Gomorah specs.

It was a tough decision to put this above Commencement because without that set-up this story couldn't be as wonderful as it is. But I really do believe it's the highlight of a series of highlights. It starts with the awesome humour of Slyssk's introduction and the hilarious lunch-canteen scam, cranks up a notch with Zayne's amazingly drawn vision of fire and destruction with the chilling realisation that he must now decide what his masters decided; how far to go in service of a vision. And ends with Weaver's beautifully rendered sequence of Zayne on the bed and Carth's explanation that he alerted 17 cities; that Zayne might be a prisoner, captured and abandoned, but someone took a leap of faith and trusted him. It starts with humour, moves through fear and ends in utter despair, with, noentheless, the faintest glimmer of hope. It's everything that this series excels at. Using humour to accentuate the sorrow and horror of Zayne's situation. And the way he clings to hope regardless.


4. The New Jedi Order: Dark Tide duology (novel duology) - Michael Stackpole
TF.N ranking - 19.

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Crouching Jedi, Hidden Bloody Obvious Vong.

This just feels like Star Wars to me. The Vong are terrifying. The heroes are heroic but also human, emotional, frail and developing. Everyone gets their moment in the spotlight. Mara and Anakin's story on Dantooine; Luke and Jacen on Belkadan. Han's heartbreaking snarl about Anakin, "He doesn't need me, he's got the Force." Jacen's fear. Anakin's emerging beautiful personality - summed up fantastically in Daeshara'cor's death scene. His assertion that he made a mistake and Chewie died; he made a mistake and Daeshara is dying. And her words to him, "We're proud of you, so proud..." The way Stackpole instinctively grasps the moment of grace inherent in a Jedi dying and becoming one with the Force. It's not about technique or mastery; it's about magic and peace.

But most importantly I think I love this duology because of the light it sheds on the Vong through Elegos' brave and perfect story-arc. Through Shedao Shai and his war with Corran. The way Corran is given a chance to shine. Ending in Elegos' bejewelled skeleton; which is just pure and spine-chilling horror. Ending in a duel of mythic proportions between two warriors over the fate of a planet. Ending in a betrayal of honour that causes planetary destruction in an oddly delicate description of speciescide, that, like Elegos' skeleton, does nothing to lessen the horror.


3. Jedi Vs Sith (comic) - Darko Macan
TF.N ranking - 31.

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She can kill you with her mind. But she'll probably just blow your hand off because your death would bring her neither joy nor profit.

I think all I need to say is -

Rain: I'm a killer too.

But since I can say more, I will. Most tragic Sith genesis story ever. You know from the start they'll pull something; change up the fates that seem written for the kids in the first comic. But somehow, watching the bratty Bug take up the mantle of Jedi, watching the honourable Tomcat betray both sides ultimately driven by the simple, visceral fear of dying, because he's a child, and watching the youngest, the most innocent, Rain voluntarily, and hollowly, and numbly agree to be a Sith apprentice, because she lacks the strength to understand it wasnt her fault, it never feels forced and feels a good deal deeper and more powerful than most of the novels I've read.


2. Yoda: Dark Rendezvous (novel) - Sean Stewart
TF.N ranking - 22.

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Yoda was unimpressed by the new Sith Recruitment posters at his local bus stop.

The scenes between Yoda and Dooku are spectacular. The characterisation of both, similarly spectacular. I'd love this book simply because it establishes - as far as I'm concerned - that Yoda loved evil Dooku more than good Anakin. But I'm aware that might be construed as petty. So I'll concentrate on the wonderful reversal of seeing Anakin and Obi-Wan arrive to save the day only to ruin Dooku's impossible, tenuous chance of redemption that you knew he wasn't going to take anyway. But still hoped for. And Scout and Whie - unintrusive original characters that shed new light on the SW galaxy. It was nice to see a charcter who wasn't fabulously strong in the force and - though this book failed to convince me that the AgriCorps aren't an entirely un-Jedilike institution - by the end I was desperately hoping Yoda would agree to train Scout himself.

This book gives Dooku untold nobility, and Yoda untold wisdom, and makes the entire situation seem like such a massive, pointless, tragic waste. The scene where Yoda, with utter sincerity, challenges Dooku to convince him the dark side is better, is electrifying.

Plus, look, it's something to do with the prequels, and I put it second on my list. A prequel book. That must surely say something for its quality, right?


1. The New Jedi Order: Traitor (novel) - Matthew Stover
TF.N ranking - 3.

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Thanks to Asta, I now cannot think of Ganner without thinkin of Adrian Paul. THANKS ASTA! *headdesk*

Brilliantly written, brutal, a masterpiece of character development and the confusion of morals and boundries. The transformation of Jacen is rendered with powerful realism, a slow journey that takes an entire book but sells you on every single step and maintains mythic heroism - light and good - against a fascinatingly confused moral background. And let's not forget Ganner. My single favourite Star Wars moment; one of my favourite book-moments in any genre. It's the dragon-killing moment. The moment that I believe is real and will survive a thousand years to be dismissed as "just a myth". The kind of moment that tells you maybe our myths were built from something incredible, but real, too.

And...that's that. :)

If you're interested in the complete TF.N list - click here

Hope y'all at least enjoyed the pretty pictures. Perhaps tomorrow, if you are all very good, I will spam you with pictures of Chiwetel Ejiofor. That might be a cheer-up-Becka method that would be more, err, flist-friendly? Well TOO LATE NOW! MWAHAHAHAHA!

Re: follow-up: Jedi Academy?

Date: 2008-03-13 04:47 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] beccatoria.livejournal.com
Hooray! Okay, you have two options. Option number one is this link:

http://rapidshare.com/files/99258126/Star_Wars_Novels_TXT.zip.html

That's basically everything they've ever published bookwise (not comicwise!) that's not either an obscure kids' book (though there are a couple of pretty obscure kids books IN there), or very, very recent. It's 33 megs which unzips to about 76 megs all told.

If you want smaller, then here's just the Bantam Era stuff (well, all the stuff from A New Hope through to just after Spectre of the Past which is nearly all Bantam Imperial Warlord Superweapon Hilarity!). This one is about 10 megs, unzips to about 25.

http://rapidshare.com/files/99261086/Bantam_Era.zip.html

Honestly I recomment the first one if you have the space, just because then you can "test drive" more stuff, and because there's endless entertainment in some of that drivel. Like the "Jedi Prince" series. A bizarrely awful series of books written in the early 90s with wonderful lines such as:

Han to Leia on why he must leave her: "Maybe so, but Lando's offered me a lease on a piece of sky near Cloud City. I've always dreamed of having a place of my own, and I figure it's about time Chewie and I built my dream sky house."

(Later it has Han cooking dinner and Chewie in an apron. I shit you not.)

Oh, also:

"Who lives in Jabba's palace now?" Ken inquired. "It's vacant," Luke said, "except for the Ranats that scurry around chewing on the furniture and drapes. You see, when Jabba died, they never found his will. So the government of Tatooine took possession of his palace. For awhile they turned it into the Tatooine Retirement Home for Aged Aliens. But there wasn't enough money in the budget to keep it open."

...but I'll stop scaring you off now. I just...I love this crap. It's the sort of stuff I'm sure they never really thought about when they decided to make everything "canon". And now I can laugh, and laugh, and laugh...

SRSLY.

But anyways, enjoy the above and if you ever want to um, "get hold of" anything SW related, I can probably hook you up. Don't feel obliged to let me know how you're getting on with it all, but I'm always happy to hear from you, cus you're cool, and it gives me an excuse to chat about Star Wars. :)

Re: follow-up: Jedi Academy?

Date: 2008-03-13 08:25 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] jo-lasalle.livejournal.com
Oh, wow, excellent! I do indeed have the space -- thank you so much!

For awhile they turned it into the Tatooine Retirement Home for Aged Aliens. But there wasn't enough money in the budget to keep it open."

... Luke was kidding, right? Right? He was telling a joke? I do like the image of Chewie in an apron. *g*

It's a really interesting concept, to have such a sprawling universe in different media and have it all (or most of it) as canon. Quite amazing, really, but I can imagine how it can come and bite you in the ass.

And I'm very tempted to let you know how I'm getting on. :-) I can feel shy (or stalkeriffic!) over just dropping in, but halfway through Last Command I was like, Ooooh, why has nobody I know read these things? I need to babble at someone!!

Again, thanks so much for all this, this is mightily awesome of you.

Re: follow-up: Jedi Academy?

Date: 2008-03-14 06:13 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] beccatoria.livejournal.com
Yay! I take it the zip file wasn't horribly busted or anything (I have bad luck with zip files...) Though I did notice that due to my horribly disorganised hard drive I left off a folder - for some reason I had the most recent series of novels in a folder parallel to the general SW Books folder, not *inside* it. Gah. So - update!

http://rapidshare.com/files/99525988/LOTF.zip.html

That's tiny, like a meg and a half; it's the first six books of the latest 9-book series, "Legacy of the Force."

... Luke was kidding, right? Right? He was telling a joke? I do like the image of Chewie in an apron. *g*

Yes. Apron!Chewie can totally stay, but Luke? I...hope he was joking. But this is a series of books so bad it has become legendary, and where the chief bad guy says things like, "My father, the Emperor, knew many things and was a master of the dark side, but even HE could not achieve perfection with only TWO EYES."

It's a really interesting concept, to have such a sprawling universe in different media and have it all (or most of it) as canon. Quite amazing, really, but I can imagine how it can come and bite you in the ass.

Yeah, it's...fascinating. And I've come to really appreciate it. But in some ways that's because it's taught me patience, compromise and the impossibility of obsessive completism in my fannishness (well, okay, that last one only slightly.) I believe the official line is that each EU story is like a window, and some are grubbier and harder to see through than others. Either way, it's a crazy patchwork of fake-reality that you've just gotta accept devolves into utter crack at some points and utter brilliance at others.

And...it's weird, but I'm cool with that. And what's weirder is that it kind of works. Like the massiveness of the project mitigates the crapness of certain parts of it. So characters like "Lumiya" can have origins in obscure and awful 1970s comic books, and then show up as complex and terrifying villains in 2006 and work, and somehow make the original material better. Or, take Episode III. I hated that film, but there's a lot of good EU work surrounding it and slowly...the film itself is less important to me, and I find other ways of being at peace with the...negative space it leaves?

Which is a horribly pretentious way of saying, yes. It is both amazing and ass-biting, but at least the ass-biting is usually hilarious!

And I'm very tempted to let you know how I'm getting on. :-) I can feel shy (or stalkeriffic!) over just dropping in, but halfway through Last Command I was like, Ooooh, why has nobody I know read these things? I need to babble at someone!!

Please do! Tell you what, I'm going to friend you (don't feel obliged to reciprocate, and let me know if you'd rather I didn't), so that maybe you'll feel less stalkerific or shy about my wanting to hear what you have to say. :D

Again, thanks so much for all this, this is mightily awesome of you.

You're absolutely welcome, it's really no bother and you've already done me a favour by providing a not totally off topic chance for me to do some babbling of my own.

Also, you're icon = squee! A friend of mine recently linked me to an utterly awesome meta-review (http://wrongquestions.blogspot.com/2008/02/back-through-wormhole-table-of-contents.html)of the entire DS9 run and it inspired me to rewatch it. Because I loved it as a kid but never really got the chance to watch it with much regularity and missed the early stuff entirely. I'm still in season 1 of my rewatch project, but, yeah. I'm really...surprised at how much I'm enjoying it. And shocked at how I managed to forget the awesomeness of the Sisko!

Re: follow-up: Jedi Academy?

Date: 2008-03-16 12:57 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] jo-lasalle.livejournal.com
Sorry, I downloaded earlier, but I had the most foggy-brained Saturday... Yes, the zip files worked out fine, no worries there! Thanks for these additions, too!

"My father, the Emperor, knew many things and was a master of the dark side, but even HE could not achieve perfection with only TWO EYES."

I'm not sure what I find more horrifying, the quote as such or things like 'my father, the Emperor' -- the guy made babies? Though of course I shouldn't be surprised. A good generation-spanning saga can't afford not to have their villains procreate too... or something. I bet they have daddy issues up the wazoo. ("My father never had time for me! All he cared about was his stupid Empire and the stupid Death Star, and on Take Your Child To Work Day I had to hang out with stupid Vader all day because my father was too busy!")

And I've come to really appreciate it. But in some ways that's because it's taught me patience, compromise and the impossibility of obsessive completism in my fannishness

I think it's great if a fandom works like that and brings out the zen in a fan. I'm... really not at all zen about most of my fandoms, previous and current (and that's a very mild way of putting it...), and I really wish I were, because I think I'd have a lot more fun and less hand-wringing at flawed canon. I'm not there yet, but maybe someday. :-)

So here's my first getting-back-comment. :-) I'm halfway through Spectre of the Past, and I have to say, I loved the meeting, prickliness and all, between Luke and Mara. I've known for a while that they eventually end up together, and I was never sure what to make of that idea, but when I realised that they (or Zahn, or whoever makes these calls) let ten years go by between them (and Issues that I'm curious about -- I'll confess that this is part of why I was curious about the JA) without rushing into anything, and the chemistry is fine... I went, 'hey, this could be pretty awesome.'

And you're a DS9 fan too! I chose the icon mainly because it's the most joyful one I have. Sisko!! I recently started my own DS9 rewatch, and I'm now up to the last nine or so episodes, and I'm totally in love again. It's a bit odd because I can totally see, besides the ways in which it holds up very well, the ways it really really doesn't, but I don't care at all.

Though I probably do need a SW icon...

Re: follow-up: Jedi Academy?

Date: 2008-03-17 07:13 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] beccatoria.livejournal.com
And I had a foggy-brained Sunday so we're even!

'my father, the Emperor' -- the guy made babies?

Actually, the guy who says that isn't the Emperor's son, he's just pretending to be so he has a claim to the throne. Hilariously, about half way through the series the Emperor's actual mutant three-eyed son turns up, except he's a pacifist who dreams up the schematics to superweapons in his sleep...

Truthfully neither of them are ever mentioned outside this abominably bad book series and most people figure the other mutant was mistaken, somehow.

Though this:

"My father never had time for me! All he cared about was his stupid Empire and the stupid Death Star, and on Take Your Child To Work Day I had to hang out with stupid Vader all day because my father was too busy!"

makes me wish otherwise!

I think I'd have a lot more fun and less hand-wringing at flawed canon. I'm not there yet, but maybe someday.

Well, me neither, truthfully. And even in Star Wars I have a...ways to go. But still, I've noticed a change in my attitudes - not in terms of obsessiveness (see knowledge of obscure children's books!), but in terms of...being at peace with accidental contradictions, and wild variances in quality, and honestly believing that someday, something will be written that makes this particular piece of crap better, somehow.

(and Issues that I'm curious about -- I'll confess that this is part of why I was curious about the JA)

I wish I could give you better news about the "issues" and the ten year gap. Basically I get the impression there was a ten year gap because Bantam were trying to run the series as half-ongoing-tale, half episode-of-the-week, and were scared to marry him off.

However, Zahn, in the books you're reading now, does a spectacular (IMO) job of retconning all that Bantam Nonsense into something really cool.

I guess what I'm saying is, you'll probably find Zahn's recap of events more interesting than the events themselves. Basically, Mara stays as a smuggler because she has some issues with the way Luke runs his academy and whether she's cut out to be a Jedi. Luke spends a lot of time angsting about giving all his attention to rebuilding the order, and ends up going out with this chick named Callista.

She has a bizarre start to character-life as the consciousness of a pre-Empire knight who ends up posessing a new body in "current" times, which leads to a surprisingly bittersweet and, I thought, interesting character arc wherein she can't touch the Force in her new body, and despite Luke's protests, leaves him to work out who she is now, and what she should be doing. It's a shame most of her arc takes place in books that are nearly universally reviled. That said, I loved her final book appearance - Planet of Twilight. I should re-read it, because I remember it being complex, touching, and letting Leia be the hero for once. But everyone else I know with any sense or taste hates it, so I might be suffering from "I was 13 at the time!" nostalgia.

Um...rambling again. Point is, yes, there are issues, and I thank Zahn for making them as complex and interesting in these books as they should have been through all of them.

It's a bit odd because I can totally see, besides the ways in which it holds up very well, the ways it really really doesn't, but I don't care at all.

Yes! I know exactly what you mean! And in some ways, even its mediocrity is coming across as maturity to me. That was one of the points in the huge review my friend linked me to, and I've decided I agree. It's a plugger. And it's at peace with the fact not every episode will be spectacular. The message of a lot of it is mundanity and it's nobility. The very last episode has Sisko swept up into the heavens, but the message is that he's coming back, life goes on, the sun will rise tomorrow, and for most people, nothing will have changed.

Though I probably do need a SW icon...

And I should probably find a DS9 one, soon!

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