BSG: Blood on the Scales

[beccatoria]

Well, that was okay. Not as good as last week, with some stellar moments and some parts that I think my reading of the show prevents me from fully appreciating.

In some ways, this episode was painful for me to watch because I love Laura more than pretty much any other fictional character and I just... Yes. Her yelling was awesome. Yes. Her teaming up with the Cylon to rain down terror and devastation upon Tom Zarek and Felix Gaeta was awesome.

I did not appreciate the undercurrent of romance that permeated the entire thing.

I feel ungrateful because, let's just say that this episode played out in an AU where Laura was not, in fact, sleeping with Adama and we know for a fact there's nothing romancey going on. And this episode happens. I honestly don't think she would have done much, if anything, different.

She still would have expressed her belief that Adama would regain control of the Galactica. Adama's "death" would still have been a moment that impressed even further, even in this insanely frakked up situation, how much more awful things could get/had gotten. It would still have represented the death of any chance to end this quasi-peacefully; she still would have made her I WILL RAIN DOWN DEVASTATION ON YOU! speech (though wouldn't it have been awesome if that was precipitated by the Quorum massacre instead?) At the end, she still would have collapsed a little, into the arms of whoever was there, because something I love about Laura is how she still feels this crap. She is more hardcore than Kara Thrace, but when she's finished hardcoring, the weight of what she's done is never lost on her and she never tries to lie to herself about how much it hurt.

Maybe I unerestimated how much canon A/R would skew my reading of her motivations just through my own defensiveness. A lot of me felt like I was 'supposed' to read a lot of romantic motivation in her choices. I resented the beats that were clearly about her fearing for Adama's life rather than putting that aside and fearing for the entirety of her species' future survival. Like I was going to somehow forget that she's with Adama if for like, thirty seconds we don't see teary-eyed close-ups.

But then again, how much of this is my defensiveness? And also, even if this is what the show is doing, if it's succumbing to those sexist romantic cliches that now that she has a MAN all her decisions are secretly about her MAN, and that while she threatens to nuke her own Fleet into oblivion, it's still her MAN that saves things in the nick of time so she doesn't have to - even if this is a true reading, there's also me and my choice to see it that way (even if I hate it). These cliches will never stop being true until we stop giving them credence and choose to read other things into those situations.

Not that I'm trying to absolve the media of good representation by claiming it has no responsibility other than pandering to the lowest common denominator, I just...

I don't know.

I think I'm hurt because dude, Laura Frakking Roslin was wielding a basestar of nuclear woah and actually using her own civilian fleet for cover, and screaming vengeance and murderous awesome, and I kind of didn't love it as much as I would have otherwise because I spent half of it worried that maybe the reason she was doing all of it was the crap reason instead of the good reason?

And this isn't the person I want to be. I don't want to be the person whose ship or anti-ship trashes their enjoyment of the show. I want to be more comfortable reading against the text when I need to, but also, I find reading against the text about certain things really exhausting. So, I don't know.

To continue my very embarassing 'shipper craziness (really, I remember when these were NOT the first thoughts I had about an episode!) OMG TIGH AND CAPRICA you are hilarious and adorkable.

"I CAN TAKE CARE OF MYSELF," (EVEN THOUGH I'M ONLY IN THIS EPISODE FOR ABOUT TWELVE SECONDS).

Yes, Caprica, yes you can. But I haven't quite forgiven you for not killing anyone with your stiletto heels. We had an agreement, woman. Let's just say, I'm assuming your journey to Baltar's Harem of Religious Crazy was punctuated by many mutinous extras who needed a stiletto to the temple.

I wonder if we'll see Helo and Hera and Caprica hanging out with Baltar's crazyfolks next episode or if we'll just skip forward an unspecified amount of time. I kind of hope we do, because that could be a WORLD of hilarious. And also, Baltar and Caprica have not actually seen each other or spoken since he and D'anna dumped her and that would be interesting and awkward.

But on the other hand, if they did that scene (and here comes the insane shipperness, really, I recognise my nutsness) it would FILL ME WITH FEAR that they were trying to get Baltar and Caprica back together again. Especially with his recent revelation to Gorgeous Six (for real, I hope she sticks around, her hair is PRETTY) that his faith really is hollow. I loved that he admitted that, and honestly, am not against Baltar making some changes and becoming a better person, as long as he does it in ways that seem genuinely perspecacious and about understanding his own flaws and addressing them (unlike, say, The Hub).

Once upon a time (i.e. at the start of season three), I would have loved seeing Caprica and Baltar get back together. At that point in the story, that relationship had a lot of what I now love about Caprica and Tigh. This sense of two deeply damaged people fumbling to put some kind of life back together, and with this sense that whatever life they could put together would always be haunted by what came before, that there was no clean slate, no getting rid of baggage. Just this messy, quiet desperation and chance that they could save each other.

But in season three Baltar and Caprica didn't save each other. They didn't save each other spectacularly.

And now it's Caprica and Tigh who give me that sense of unbelievable baggage and damage and yet, oddly, hope that I used to get from Caprica and Baltar. And from this perspective, having Caprica get back together with Baltar, or, indeed, having Tigh get back together with Ellen, feels very false. Like going back to "the good old days," when that shouldn't ever be possible. Like a fake second chance.

And I guess that also, being involved with the Caprica/Baltar relationship far more from her POV than his, if they got back together, no matter how much he'd repented and become a better person, I'd always feel that he didn't deserve it and that it somehow meant that it was okay to treat someone that badly repeatedly because there's always time to be sorry later. I actually want to see Baltar become a better, more whole person and less of a godawful excuse for a human being. I also honestly believe he's always loved Caprica in this difficult, confused, selfish way. And I think that he missed his chance with her, and that if he realises that, the poignancy could be heartbreaking. For both of them. Because they still love each other, but it's...too late.

And then he can get together with someone else. A fill-in for a lost love who he can maybe learn to actually love if he learns about compromise and reality. The same way that Tigh was Caprica's "I'll love anyone I can save," and Caprica was Tigh's "Not-Quite Ellen," and Baltar and Caprica were each other's pale immitations of respective Head!Characters. Together all three (four, really, with Ellen) of them form a beautiful, lost, broken dance, but I want them to keep moving forward, in new steps, rather than backward repeating old ones.

AHAHAAHA, that could lead to Gaius/Ellen. Actually... No, please someone stop me before accidentally I hurt myself.

Lastly, politics.

I feel bad - I've always enjoyed Gaeta but I've never loved him. I think that his deicisions here were understandable given the story and that it was effective to make Gaeta the character they used for this.

Probably the most affecting moment for me was when he found out Zarek had murdered the Quorum. Everything about why he did it was there - including his anger. They had the truth on their side, and now, they have massacres to cover up that make them as bad as the people he wants to fight against. And Zarek, claiming that the truth is whatever the winners claim, just broke Gaeta's heart because the truth, the objective truth as he could understand it, was the only reason he did any of this.

In many ways I'm still completely confused by Zarek's attitudes. I find myself minding less about my inability to really understand him as I consider his tenure across the show. I thought when he was introduced, he was just there to simplistically reverse the stereotype of terrorist freedom fighters. Well, not simplistically because to be fair to the show (and to the most excellent episode Bastille Day), they never ever uncomplicated the reasons for his imprisonment or his attitudes. But I did think that they were trying to show complexity in his actions and the politics surrounding them while making the man himself very idealistic, in a "not all terrorists are evil, m'kay?" kind of way. At that point, if they'd suddenly revealed that Zarek was, in fact, just another powerhungry piece of dirt who had big words for murdering the government, it would have been dumb, and suddenly turned the whole thing into, "oh oops, terrorists ARE evil, m'kay?" But I think four years later, maybe that's enough time passed that it's just interesting. Enough time that the "noble terrorist," is in itself a cliche reversal of a cliche.

BSG is always better when confusing boundaries than when simplistically reversing them. It's always better when the gender-swap, the religion-swap, the racial-swap, the political-swap that puts you on the "other" side to the one you're usually one, is a messy and very imperfect fit.

My bloodthirst from last week isn't totally quenched.

I'm really glad that Gaeta and Zarek got executed.

Not glad in the sense that I, as a viewer, enjoyed watching him get his comeuppance, but just...satisified. It was the right ending. It was pointless and hollow and the only way it could possibly end. And no, I'm not blind to the irony that the response to a coup whose defining attribute was execution without trial, is...execution probably without trial. It doesn't make things equal because circumstances are different, but I'm not blind to it either, and it certainly adds to my feeling that this didn't resolve or fix anything. Compare this to Adama, Roslin, Lee, Starbuck and Billy having a picnic in a tent on Kobol.

What I don't know is what the hell's going to happen to everyone else. Knowing Adama and his unsurprising attitude to the marines who were about to kill him, in just assuming that now they'll follow him to CIC (which like, of COURSE they will because they don't want to die in a firing squad and because they've been captured and because a lot of people are basically sheep) is to just assume that now that the leaders have been killed, they can all go back to serving under him, and we'll see some bitching in the rec room as Starbuck punches Racetrack a few times and that'll serve for continuity regarding that HILARIOUS TIME she helped murder people.

(Note: I have chosen, for the sake of my sanity, to view Racetrack laughing at Zarek's jokes as a canny bit of self-preservation on her part. Because really, if Zarek had told me a joke at that point, I would have laughed too. If only from nervous adrenaline.)

But yeah, that scenario is what I don't want. I no longer know if I want these people put up against a wall and shot for similar reasons to Gaeta (because, you know, I never wanted that for any of them, I just think/thought the story demanded it). Maybe not. Maybe my bloodlust is cooling a little. But...I want something.

Because I disagree with everything Narcho did and think he's kind of a jerk, but he said it very succinctly when he said, "I've always respected you, but I hate the Cylons. And I can't take orders from a leader who won't fight them."

Now, I also think this is a ridiculously short-sighted view of the fact that Adama is still fighting, or at least actively defending the fleet from, the Cylon, just...you know, the ENTIRE REST OF THE SPECIES rather than this one rag-tag half-destroyed basestar that committed next-generation genocide on their own species as an indication that maybe, just maybe, they are a tiny bit trustworthy in terms of a mutual defense treaty.

So maybe the government needs better frakking PR or something because I know it's a weird concept, but it's also a pretty simple one. When the enemy defects, you use that resource.

But still. People think like Narcho. This will not change. It needs to be addressed.

As, to be honest, does the fact that the heads of the civilian government and the military are literally in bed with each other. I don't necessarily think this is illegal, or whatever, and given the circumstances, even if it were, well, I'm also aware how loose the frat regs are in the military these days. But I can see why it worries people. To be honest, it kind of worries me, though I'm obviously not unbiased.

I don't mind hardline Roslin and her somewhat sketchy political ethics. But I will mind if they don't rebuild the Quorum.

Random Other Things:

- Not a single Agathon got to kill Gage or Vireem. I find this disappointing.

- Hera? Still creepy. "Ouch." Where, "Ouch," comes with an expression that looks a little like, "You know what? Human flesh looks TASTY." Subsequently, I continue to adore her.

- NO! NOT SAM! I DEMAND THAT YOU SURVIVE!

- I'm not entirely sure why I'm not getting horrific flashbacks to the quadrangle of doom, but I think it's the lack of melodrama or attempt to say, use a horrifically brutal mutiny as background to some relationship angst, and instead there's just...this complicated situation where no one's really the bad guy and no one's getting drunk and losing wedding rings. Probably the fact I like the quasi-platonic not-quite-sibling vibe that Starbuck and Apollo have reclaimed since Maelstrom also helps.

- They give Roslin the big, emotional romantic moment of "OMG HE'S DEAD," about Adama. But for Adama? Yeah. Tigh. IJS.

- I think Chief's "It wouldn't have mattered," was in response to Kelly's hypothetical warning that Cally was trouble. But...I kind of like it more expansively, also in response to his kid not being a Cylon. That ultimately, he would have been okay with that because he loved Cally and loves Nicky. I'm not wild that this yet again underlines this show's somewhat weird obsession with filandering women and the stoic men who love them anyway, but it's better than just pissing all over her again. I still think it's the stupidest retcon ever, but I'm a tiny bit mollified that RDM apparently said in an interview his intention wasn't to make Cally seem like a cheater but more like Cally and Chief didn't get together straight after the jaw incident and that was a lot later, and she'd been seeing Hot Dog but then Chief suddenly proposed out of the blue or something. Which, really, HOW would we have assumed that? But also, better than nothing. Also I really like "your kid's not a cylon," because it doesn't assume that Nicky is no longer his kid. Because THEY ARE ADORABLE.

- NO! GALACTICA! DON'T FALL APART NOW! WE HAVE SIX EPISODES TO GO!

- I am a bad, bad, feelingless human being. I found Gaeta's "It stopped," about his leg right before they got shot to be a) cheesy and b) something that really pulled me out of the moment.

- SHOW. IT IS VERY CRUEL TO TEASE ME WITH SCENES OF WILLIAM ADAMA GETTING SHOT TO DEATH BEFORE REVEALING IT WAS ALL A BIG DREAM.

So, there's that. I liked it. Not as much as last week's and I'm still - and this is painful to admit - getting to grips with Laura Roslin again.

Comments

[whatever-lj.livejournal.com]

I looked forward to seeing your analysis, and as usual, you don't disappoint.

Roslin -- Yeah! Why, oh why, did they need to keep swooping in for big close-ups of her teary-eyed face? I guess I am an AR shipper, but I still found it insulting -- does the show not think that I will remember that she likes Adama? And I thought I'd throw up when she murmers "Bill!" when she thinks he's dead. Yucky.

The whole QUORUM was exectuted! When she come down the ladder of love and collapses at the site of Adama, I like to think that she has been briefed on the massacre, and when she falls apart it is not just because she sees Adama alive and well -- I like to think she falls apart because she is truly OBE (over- come by events) -- the events: being shot at in a raptor, the frustration with the radio, the struggles on the cylon baseship, the search for the proper words to convince the fleet, that this may be the end of the human race, finding out that the WHOLE QUORUM has been MASSACRED -- oh, and it's good that Bill is alive, too.

I do think you're wrong though, about Adama not being given a reaction to the news that Tigh has been executed. I thought it was perfect and moving -- no screaming and crying, just the quiet beat of devestation. This time I thought the show was trusting me to know that Bill had just taken one in the chest (and he didn't have to whisper "Saul" with teary eyes).

[beccatoria.livejournal.com]

Hey, I'm glad you enjoyed reading. :)

BOO TO TEARY-EYED CLOSE-UPS!

But just to clarify, I didn't mean to suggest that Adama was emotionless when told about Tigh, sorry. I wasn't contrasting emotional responses, I was contrasting who the writers chose to lie about being dead to give Adama and Roslin bit awful emotional moments. My point was just that Adama/Tigh is clearly the REAL OTP of this show. :p

[sache8.livejournal.com]

Heya. I followed you here from grav_ity's incessant chatter about how you guys lived and breathed BSG together. Your episode recaps are really enjoyable to read. Entertaining, even-- the stiletto line had me in stitches. ;-)

I just wanted to say that while I'm not a live and breath die-hard Roslin/Adama shipper, neither does the ship really bother me. I honestly feel I can say with a fair amount of credibility that my perspective of the ship is pretty objective, and while I definitely recognized the beats of "Oh my love!Angst" with Roslin's part of this ep, I didn't get the feeling that they were affecting her in such a way that she would have done anything she wouldn't have done without the romance element. I think that Roslin was just plain furious. After all, the relationship between her and Zarek has its own history. My perception of her actions was just Roslin doing her Roslin thing. I don't know if that makes you feel better, but I thought I'd put it out there. ;-)

My particularly rabid fangirl tendencies in this fandom tend almost exclusively toward Anders, the Agathons, and Bear McCreary, with honorable secondary but-not-quite-as intense love for Chief and Tigh, so I suppose in some way that accounts for my 'detachment.'

That being said:

- NO! NOT SAM! I DEMAND THAT YOU SURVIVE!

*wimpers* I'm over here hyperventilating with concern, myself. I can't believe we have to wait a week. Although, the fact that is still open-ended suggests that, even if they do off him, he'll at least get a good dose of focus.

[emmiere.livejournal.com]

Jumping in, I hope you don't mind ;). HI, FELLOW SAM FAN! I've been pretty concerned, mostly that he'll die before he gets actual plot, but I think it's too early for him to be potentially offed. So I hope you can stop hyperventilating soon, because I do believe we will get a lot of Sam, no matter the end game.

I like that your rabid fangirl tendencies include Bear McCreary. :)

[sache8.livejournal.com]

I like that your rabid fangirl tendencies include Bear McCreary. :)

Hahahahahaha. Yeah...Movie/Film music has always been a niche passion of mine, and, well, what can I say? O:-) One day he's going to stand on that big Academy stage and win his first Oscar for Best Original Score and I'm going to be watching and weeping with joy and pride. *G*

I shall take your optimism about Sammy to heart. *hugs him*

Do you watch Big Bang Theory? Michael Trucco guest starred in their Christmas episode, and for a show about a huge bunch of nerds (that very often makes BSG jokes) they didn't make one single cylon reference!!! I was so disappointed. But still seeing him there was beyond awesome, especially since I totally wasn't expecting it.

Friending, if that's okay. :-)

[beccatoria.livejournal.com]

Hi! Nice to meet you! :D I'm glad the read was entertaining and it's always great to meet new people.

It does actually help to know that you didn't see it that way. I really don't trust my objectivity here and I'm happy to cling to anything that suggests my reading was somewhat paranoid rather than what was really going on!

OMG I LOVE BEAR MCCREARY! He's just...unbelievably amazing and talented. The music on this show is beautiful beyond words.

I also heart Anders which is a surprise to me because I found him unutterably bland when he was introduced, but basically started changing my mind pretty damn quickly as soon as he came back in Downloaded.

I'm fascinated by the Agathons, but especially this season, Athena is creeping me out a little.

Basically my fandom is Laura Roslin and anything mystically cylonic (with Tigh skyrocketing since the start of S3).

I AM CONVINCED THAT WE CAN SAVE SAM THROUGH THE POWER OF FANGIRL.

Maybe he is like Tinkerbell and we just have to clap real hard. *whimper*

[sache8.livejournal.com]

I also heart Anders which is a surprise to me because I found him unutterably bland when he was introduced, but basically started changing my mind pretty damn quickly as soon as he came back in Downloaded.

Hehe, no, see, I lost my heart in the goodbye scene with Kara when he kissed her hand. And then that solitary hero shot at the end of the episode. It appealed to both aspects of my fangirling over eye candy: the classic romance archetype and the *cough* HOT side. *blushes* (He's so tall, and...and... I'm going to stop now. I really do try to be a good girl).

Ironically, Bear is partially to blame for this reaction, because "A Promise to Return" playing in the score underneath only escalated the feelings that were already taking firm root. And yes, Bear is more responsible than any other person on the BSG creative team for keeping me in the show. There have been a few periods where I found the content so objectionable that I tried giving it up, and he sucked me back in. Darn musicians.

I AM CONVINCED THAT WE CAN SAVE SAM THROUGH THE POWER OF FANGIRL.

Maybe he is like Tinkerbell and we just have to clap real hard. *whimper*

*dies laughing* Hey, if that's what it takes. My willpower is already on overtime this week.

[emmiere.livejournal.com]

Together all three (four, really, with Ellen) of them form a beautiful, lost, broken dance, but I want them to keep moving forward, in new steps, rather than backward repeating old ones.

No, no. Don't stop. ;) This is a quad o' doom I can get behind, basically because the doom will be that of others if they are unleashed on the universe in tandem. But, I am against the retreading of old ground in general, it's why I can't ever get behind the idea Chief and Boomer getting back together, even though they are basically the same person now. So, IDK, all I really want is for Caprica to not get dumped again and everything can fall into place from there.

I really enjoy your analysis/squee this week, especially on Laura, but this was oddly the part that caught my attention. :)

[beccatoria.livejournal.com]

I would pay actual money to watch Saul, Caprica, Ellen and Gaius go out and try to Get Something Done. Like, anything. Grocery shopping. Resolving a hostage situation. I wouldn't care. It would be amazing.

But yeah, you're right, how odd that we've found a quadrangle of doom that works and it's this one.

Though basically I agree with you. Caprica not getting dumped is my only prerequisite. All else is up for grabs!

[pellucid.livejournal.com]

I would pay actual money to watch Saul, Caprica, Ellen and Gaius go out and try to Get Something Done. Like, anything. Grocery shopping. Resolving a hostage situation. I wouldn't care. It would be amazing.

This is an idea of genius. OMG!

[beccatoria.livejournal.com]

IF ONLY SOMEONE WOULD WRITE IT.

I would, but I am bad at both humour and plot. Alas. :(

[cyborganize.livejournal.com]

I resented the beats that were clearly about her fearing for Adama's life rather than putting that aside and fearing for the entirety of her species' future survival.

YES THAT YES. dude, it is BREAKING MY HEART that you are blaming yourself for the disappointment rather than THE MAN. cliches are cliches because there is a whole naturalized architecture of domination behind them, NOT because we angry feminists can't make them go away with the power of our minds! SHOW, THIS IS NOT ACCEPTABLE. what a waste.

I haven't watched it yet, btw, but poor Melissa gave me the blow-by-blow. My episode synopsis after having it described to me on IM: "My cock." "MY cock." "No, MY cock." "Bill's cock!" *dueling cocks* "MAGIC COCK."

OK, going to read the rest of the post now. I just had to get that out...

(sadly, I have banned myself from IM this morning so that I can actually leave the house *pout*)

[beccatoria.livejournal.com]

*tries to put your heart back together*

I understand what you're saying. I don't want to excuse THE MAN just because I don't want to read against the text to make it okay again. (I have the entirety of Star Wars canon for that). I don't...I don't know. I'm so desperate not to be disappointed with this show. And so frustrated that we have like, six episodes left and now is when it starts to worry me? It's...unfair.

And all her actions could have been the same and just shot differently and it would have made such a difference. Like instead of teary-eyedness if we'd gotten steely "next crisis," resolve.

Your episode synopsis is hilarious and not entirely inaccurate. I think I was largely unwounded by the dueling cocks just because the entire mutiny was about boys and I already knew that, and I was already less invested than I wanted to be in it just because the main characters it was about (Adama, Zarek, Gaeta) are not that interesting to me. But two of them are dead now!

I would have been okay with the dueling cocks of mutiny if Laura hadn't had to get involved while seemingly capitulating to them. That's basically my issue with the episode more than the fact that the boring boys got a lot of play.

Anyway, thanks for your moral support. *flails*

I MISS YOU ON IM, but do support the notion of actually leaving the house once in a while. Which I haven't done yet today and now it's ten past ten. Say hello to the world for me!

[nightxade.livejournal.com]

- SHOW. IT IS VERY CRUEL TO TEASE ME WITH SCENES OF WILLIAM ADAMA GETTING SHOT TO DEATH BEFORE REVEALING IT WAS ALL A BIG DREAM.

*comfort* Oh my darling, the scene had dreamy lighting all over it. Plus Adama is badass enough not to require no damn blindfold. And I should hope the marines are badass enough not to require a damn target.

Gaeta: Itchy stump = conscious? I really wanted him to start singing at the end. Not out of defiance. Just out of.. Gaeta. I'm glad he got a sort of humanizing at the end with Baltar, but glad they didn't cheapen his entire efforts. His insistence on a trial proved that that's what he really wanted. He wanted get in Daddy's face and let him know just how much he failed his children.

Was he counting on there being a reckoning? Was that his out? "I want them to remember who I am." Not what he did. Who he was. All interesting thought-provoking thoughtiness there.

But ultimately, I can't forgive him because as right as he was in many places, he ordered the president's transport to be shot down. I don't see that as much different from Zarek killing the Quorum. ("Ding Dong The Quorum's Dead!" *grin*)

Laura: I don't think your anger over R/A here is unjustified. You know I ship them, but not romantically. This was "I'm reigning hell because you killed my honey!" That's not the Laura Roslin I want.

Zarek: There was no indication that he wanted anything other than power in this coup, nor in anything he's ever done prior. He knows the right words to play on people's rage, fear and hatred, but he's never ever given them any alternatives to what the opposition offers. In that, he has remained consistent.

Kelly: Thank you for him and his issues with the whole thing. Wonderful.

Narcho: Thank you for his honesty. I don't think though that Adama has done as you said regarding the marines etc. There will be a reckoning for those who actively took part in the coup. He gave Narcho a chance. Narcho responded honestly. Adama locked him up. But now's not the time and place for a major justice seeking. There's going to have to be a lot of allowance for repentence.

Narcho's view: Yes, people like him can't (easily) be changed. Hate gets into the blood. It can't get out with kind words. 25/35 ships were with Gaeta and Zarek. That's a lot of PR that A/R are going to need to work on. VP Lee has a lot of work ahead of him. But yes, as you said, no one has merely been cuddling with the enemy. People have to look at the bigger picture.

We had a similar RL situation when the Gulf War II started, with Americans (and even some Canadians) believing Canada refused to help. THe poorly conveyed truth is that we disagreed with the war on Iraq, but promised to help the fight on terrorism. Consequently, we've had supply ships in the Gulf, have taken the front in Afghanistan to free up US troops to go to Iraq, and it was later revealed that specific Canadians were actually in Iraq doing highly specialized work.

And finally: My previews are more awesome than your previews. I can offer you Sam comfortiness. "All will be revealed!"

[beccatoria.livejournal.com]

EVEN DREAM ADAMA DEATH IS BETTER THAN NOTHING! *criez*

But yeah, it was fairly obviously a dream sequence.

I also agree with you about Gaeta. I'm very glad that they kept him more human throughout and while arguably they could have made it more ambiguous, I do think that the show supports a reading of Gaeta having very good points.

It's an awful thing that Gaeta probably will be remembered as a mutineer rather than the resistance fighter he was on New Caprica. I think the way this mutiny is remembered both by the show and the characters in the show in the last run of episodes will be...interesting. And thinky. Although I don't have words for those thoughts yet.

I'm both relieved and saddened to know you think my reading of the A/R situation is accurate. Relieved because it means I'm not a paranoid crazy person but saddened because I want the show to be better than this. I want the old Laura Roslin back, dammit. The one who might say, "I love you," to Bill Adama but in the next breath was gonna tell him to blow the ship she is on to hell. :(

I agree with you on Narcho and Kelly. They were really well written here and helped show various sides of the issue. I hope you're right about the fallout too.

I think the thing that shocked me more than the mention of the numbers of ships was how SMALL that number is. 35? I remember when Roslin took a third of the Fleet with her to Kobol and that in itself was over 20 ships. I didn't realise they'd lost so many!

Thanks for the information about the Canada Gulf War II situation - I didn't actually know that. But very interesting.

Also, your previews are more awesome than the American previews, and DEFINITELY more awesome than MY previews which are...nonexistent! But OMG yes, I found the Space preview. *massive relief*

[nightxade.livejournal.com]

Really? We have the gooder previews! woot! Finally we get to be ahead on something geeky!

[nightxade.livejournal.com]

Also, I'm upset that you didn't comment on (did I miss?) Tory or on Romo's pen, which, as far as I'm concerned, was as good as Caprica stilettoing someone. She was too busy obsessively holding robot baby, anyway. No time for heeling.

[beccatoria.livejournal.com]

Yes. Space > Scifi in the preview department like, EVERY TIME.

I didn't comment on Tory cus, well, she didn't do much except stand around with awesome hair (although not quite as awesome as New Six's hair) and be generally angstacular about abandoning the Fleet. And tbh, I'm still not really sure why "OMG BUT ADAMA WILL NOT LIKE YOU ANYMORE," worked on them, but whatever. I like to think that Tory convinced them so that Laura didn't have to look like a crazyperson in front of them and the entire thing was Tory saving face for her former BFF.

But, um, in terms of not insane stuff, yeah. Tory was there, but not really hugely interesting. Although I enjoy her position of Rebel Cylon spokesperson.

But yes. The pen was pretty awesome. I actually wasn't a fan of including Romo in this episode because I thought it was bad fanservice, but I did enjoy the pen, though srsly Mr Marine, a civilian just KILLED YOU WITH A PEN, dude. That's...a poor showing.

It is almost as good as Caprica stilletoing someone, but not quite. Because it wasn't Caprica and that is half of what makes it hilarious.

The robot baby wouldn't have presented a serious problem. She can just use her free had. Or like...leave the stiletto on her foot and kick people. I am pretty easy about this. :|

[nightxade.livejournal.com]

I was getting the feeling that Tory was slowly trying to be the boss, what with all the Cylons left on the basestar being the lost ones. She certainly has opportunity and is definitely all about "these are my peeps now and we're better than you." I thought it was more Leoben who convinced them not to run away.

As much as I loved seeing Romo, he was certainly wasted, but then maybe not because Gaeta really did want a trial so it was nice of him to get Adama a good lawyer. And really. Pen. Love. Penlove.

[daybreak777.livejournal.com]

I spent half of it worried that maybe the reason she was doing all of it was the crap reason instead of the good reason?
Ah, interesting. It doesn't bother me that she may have done it all for love. And I don't even ship them. Love for Adama, love for the fleet. It's all wrapped up for me. She is like wife and mother. Yes, I know she hasn't been that for so long. But you made me see it. Her kids died in the hospital while she was away. (She didn't know yet, but still.) They told her her man was dead. I'm okay with her rage about that. It would have been cool without the romance too, though. I guess I could go either way with it.

I haven't quite forgiven you for not killing anyone with your stiletto heels.
Hee! This made me giggle. I love how you want every woman on this show kicking ass and taking names just because they can. That would be awesome.

Tigh get back together with Ellen, feels very false. Like going back to "the good old days,"
Yes, there should be no good old days. Will Baltar get Head!Six and the lab back? We can't go back. Though Tigh and Ellen seem rather epic so I don't know.

Maybe my bloodlust is cooling a little. But...I want something.
I want something too. I WANT ALL MUTINEERS DEAD. I'm probably not going to get that. But I think that makes me more ragey. Because Narcho and Gage and Connor are still out there. This totally needs to be addressed. I don't even care how they die. Accidentally, one an episode, is fine by me. But Connor's going to turn up on the bad side of any future conflict. Seelix too. Gage is still a rapist. No way these people should be running loose.

But I can see why it worries people. To be honest, it kind of worries me, though I'm obviously not unbiased.
I am deeply, deeply worried. The people are just sheep and will follow Mom and Dad. But it's wrong. And it worries me very much. And if left unaddressed, like the tear in Galactica, it can all come apart even more spectacularly. Though with six eps to go I can't imagine things getting worse.

But then again, this is BSG.

[beccatoria.livejournal.com]

I think the reason I'm upset about it isn't that Roslin felt an emotional reaction about her personal life, or that Roslin was passionately emotionally engaged in the action she was taking to save the Fleet. My issue was with the way those two things intersected. Adama uses his personal feelings to gauge what's best for the people, and often even makes selfishly motivated decisions because he has personal emotional investment.

But Roslin is the complete opposite. She feels things deeply, but her personal feelings come second to her role as a leader. Her emotional investment and passion for her people is separate from the people she loves as Laura Roslin.

Like when Billy died. There was Laura Roslin, the President, furious that these people were taking hostages and jeopardising the future of democratic society, and there was Laura Roslin, the human being, terrified for her surrogate son's safety. And the surrogate mother had to stay in the background until the crisis was over, even though both roles wanted to save Billy.

So like...I just wanted her to be oldskool Laura Roslin, who would have been raining down destruction from the basestar because she was mad as hell that Zarek would put the future of humankind under this much of a threat, and who would compartmentalise and collapse later about her personal feelings about Bill.

I guess I don't mind her rage at Bill's death so much as the suggestion that it eclipses her rage that all her kids might die in Zarek's frakked-up hospital?

Bah, I don't know, I'm turning into a one-note bitter fan. :(

I love how you want every woman on this show kicking ass and taking names just because they can. That would be awesome.

Well in this instance it's because there is CLEARLY no other good reason for stiletto heels to exist. But in general, yes. I want that just because they can. AND IT WOULD BE AWESOME. I'm glad you see that. :p

Because Narcho and Gage and Connor are still out there. This totally needs to be addressed.

Absolutely.

The people are just sheep and will follow Mom and Dad. But it's wrong.

Again, absolutely.

I mean, I also think that Laura and Adama are doing the right thing in this instance. But I want people to follow them because they recognise that, not because they'll follow whoever is in charge. Because then what happens when someone like Zarek is in charge?

And yeah, I wouldn't be at all surprised if it just keeps getting worse...

[daybreak777.livejournal.com]

I just wanted her to be oldskool Laura Roslin, who would have been raining down destruction from the basestar because she was mad as hell that Zarek would put the future of humankind under this much of a threat, and who would compartmentalise and collapse later about her personal feelings about Bill.
Oldskool Laura Roslin is gone. We have a version of her but not the same, no. I miss oldskool Laura, Bill, so many oldskool characters . . . But these new!Bill and new!Laura run the fleet. I don't know what they might do.

I have to watch again, but I don't even know if Laura knew about the Quorum. She only knew what Zarek fed her and he fed her something he thought would break her. Silly Zarek, thinking any Laura capable of surrender.

Bah, I don't know, I'm turning into a one-note bitter fan. :(
It's your journal, be as bitter as you like. I just ranted and am still out for blood in my journal about my boy and how rational is that?

And general, yes. I want that just because they can. AND IT WOULD BE AWESOME. I'm glad you see that. :p
This made me LOL. Thanks for that. :-)

what happens when someone like Zarek is in charge?
Or Baltar? Or . . . anyone not Them? The answer isn't to take the choice from the people. I don't know what the answer is.

I wouldn't be at all surprised if it just keeps getting worse...
Probably. Still keeps me on the edge of my seat, though.

[beccatoria.livejournal.com]

It's your journal, be as bitter as you like. I just ranted and am still out for blood in my journal about my boy and how rational is that?

Awwww *hugs* I'm so sorry for you. I don't feel your pain in this particular instance, because Gaeta was never my boy, but...I empathise. I understand why it makes you angry and upset.

[indigo419.livejournal.com]

And also, even if this is what the show is doing, if it's succumbing to those sexist romantic cliches that now that she has a MAN all her decisions are secretly about her MAN, and that while she threatens to nuke her own Fleet into oblivion, it's still her MAN that saves things in the nick of time so she doesn't have to - even if this is a true reading, there's also me and my choice to see it that way (even if I hate it).

Hmmm, interesting. I do see that the cliche is there to be read if one wants to stop there. But I have also been enjoying what I see as the mirroring between the K/L and A/R relationships. I don't think of K/L as being traditional - or maybe it is, except in reverse - but one thing I like about it is that Lee and Kara rely upon each other, know each other's responses in a crisis situation even without conferring with each other or even being able to see each other. And I thought that that was the same with Bill and Laura here. Laura doesn't know that Bill's still alive, but she acts on the assumption that he is, and is moving her pawns to be where she anticipates him to be in three or four moves. Bill doesn't know what Laura's doing, but he counts on her to come through, and indeed she does, sending him a shot of courage just when he thinks he's lost it all/Saul.

I felt we were shown a Laura who might break, who was teary when she thought that Adama might be dead or dying, but she never lost sight of her job: to keep the fragile alliance together one more day. Fight 'em until we can't. She's realized once again that the task is not so much to make it to the goal, to Earth, but to just keep moving, one day at a time. That's what Lee is doing, what all of Team Adama is doing. Not giving in to despair. So maybe in that sense the whole thing is a big paean to love, or at least to the daily interactions that anchor one to life: Kara/Lee or Kara+/Sam, Athena/Helo, Galen+Nicky, even Galen+Kelly.

[beccatoria.livejournal.com]

Interesting reading. I don't disagree per se, but I think my problems with the situation exist more in parallel to your commentary than in opposition to it?

I agree that there's this wonderful sense of interpersonal connection in the series and that those connections often inform - positively and negatively - the actions our characters take. I'm also not against that being explored as some kind of paean to love.

I think my problem is when this becomes Laura's primary motivation as opposed to saving the human race, which it always was before. If that's what's happening.

Basically because my OTP is Laura/her people and because the thing I've loved most about her character since the mini series is the fact that she doesn't think she's important. Everyone else is important. Humanity is important and she will do anything and sacrifice herself in any way to save her people.

Bill exists in a world of personal loyalties and loves, and while I don't always think the show succeeds in his case, I certainly believe that his attitude toward life - finding strength and wisdom to make wider decisions in his personal relationships - is a valid one.

But it's also not Laura's way.

I want the Laura Roslin who is terrified for Billy in the hostage situation, but who responds as the President. Who is outraged as the President. And then who, when it's over, cries because she just lost her only family.

And I don't know if I saw that here.

I'm not sure if - for Laura's character specifically - they'd be able to convince me that "she's so strong because of a Laura/Anyone relationship," wasn't...making her smaller somehow?

It reduces her strength to that relationship instead of making that relationship a potential part of her strength. And I think that this episode fell down on the wrong side of that line.

Often just in small ways. An "okay, next crisis," face instead of a "teary-eyed OMG BILL," face would have changed a lot of my perceptions, I think?

But anyway, thank you for commenting: certainly a lot to think about there.

[kiki-miserychic.livejournal.com]

Laura does not do it all for the nookie.

I laughed at Caprica's quick "I have Hera" when they were leaving. All the operahouse dreams and Athena's chill with Caprica taking Hera protective mommy-style. Tigh and Caprica were good for the LOLZ, while being adorable.

Gorgeous Sixes hair is made of magic.

Gaeta is an idealist, which is the best and worst character trait of BSG characters. It either makes them a hero or dead or evil.

Zarek was a poor choice as a partner. He was in it for his own reasons that didn't sync up with Gaeta. Gaeta wanted to make things better and Zarek seemed like the best blunt instrument to use. This has been what Zarek wanted from the beginning of the series and he got. At a high price to himself and the ones around him.

I don't like that Gaeta was executed simply because it's what he wanted to do to Adama, except idealism kept Gaeta from gunning him down. Gaeta put on the farce of a trial because he wanted something to justify what he was doing beyond his own principles and the good of the Fleet. There was not much else besides execution that could have happened to Gaeta. I did expect Gaeta to shoot Zarek in the head and then off himself in the CIC.

I think Gaeta was right. His methods weren't, but his reasons were. I don't know how much motivations count when the reality of his actions led to death.

The main reasons I don't like A/R is that they bring out the worst in each other and it's like creating a freaking dynasty/dictatorship/royal family.

Tyrol was a BAMF this episode.

[beccatoria.livejournal.com]

I sure as hell hope Laura doesn't do it all for the nookie, because for real, I know places where she could get better nookie for that shit.

I think that maybe Athena is more okay with Caprica helping Hera due not only to the extreme situation but also because Caprica is probably less threatening now that she's distracted by her own miracle flipperbaby. But yes, it is very entertaining.

Gorgeous Sixes hair is made of magic.

Magic and PONIES. I want it like I'm eight years old.

Zarek was a poor choice as a partner. He was in it for his own reasons that didn't sync up with Gaeta.

You know, I wonder if Gaeta trusted Zarek more because on New Caprica he wouldn't go along with the cylon government and so Gaeta had him pegged as some kind of man of Resistancey Principle? I hadn't thought about that before, but Zarek was in custody and who knows how well Gaeta knew him around that time, or how much VP Zarek hated Baltar's cruddy government pre-Occupation and bitched about it to Gaeta? I hadn't really thought about it before, but those two almost certainly had a pre-existing relationship.

I did expect Gaeta to shoot Zarek in the head and then off himself in the CIC.

It wouldn't have surprised me either, but I'm glad he didn't. Adama got out of having to kill Cain because someone else did it for him. Gaeta doing that would have felt like the writers trying to give Adama an "out" so that he didn't have to order his execution. Which...horrific though it was, was the kind of awful ending this story needed to have.

It was an ugly story and I would have been angry if Adama got a pass on doing something ugly.

The main reasons I don't like A/R is that they bring out the worst in each other and it's like creating a freaking dynasty/dictatorship/royal family.

Exactly. And it pisses me off because if Roslin were at her best around him, I wouldn't be worried about it being a dynasty/royal family. Grr.

Tyrol was a BAMF this episode.

Word.

[kiki-miserychic.livejournal.com]

Tory gives better everything, Laura!

When Caprica had Hera I was like, "ohhhh, so you let the actual six from your dream pick up Hera, but you shoot Natalie for touching her arm while being a six?" Ok, Athena, I see your logic.

I have an insane desire to braid Gorgeous Six's hair.

Maybe Gaeta thought Zarek was his best bet in the situation. Zarek was an important figure even pre-series. Gaeta might have been counting on Zarek's pull in government too.

*pets Gaeta* There was no other way this story could have ended really. That scene with Baltar made me cry. Nobody makes me cry my own tears!

I loved the cuts back to Tyrol crawling, crawling, crawling, having a great scene, crawling, crawling, SAVING THE DAY, noticing how the ship is falling apart, then probably more crawling to get back out.

I'm totally out of sync with most of my flist on this episode, so it's nice to read the Cylon Internet posts. :)

[asta77.livejournal.com]

she still would have made her I WILL RAIN DOWN DEVASTATION ON YOU! speech (though wouldn't it have been awesome if that was precipitated by the Quorum massacre instead?)

I would have loved to have seen a reaction to that, but I doubt very much she (nor any of them) had knowledge of the slaughter of the Quorum until after she returned to Galactica. Still, it would have been awesome if we had even a brief shot of her returning to Colonial One and just seeing blood everywhere. And will we get to see Laura deal with the fact that had she not turned her back on her job and created some domestic fantasy with Adama this all might have been avoided?

A lot of me felt like I was 'supposed' to read a lot of romantic motivation in her choices. I resented the beats that were clearly about her fearing for Adama's life rather than putting that aside and fearing for the entirety of her species' future survival. Like I was going to somehow forget that she's with Adama if for like, thirty seconds we don't see teary-eyed close-ups.

Maybe it’s denial on my part. Maybe it’s just easier for me to enjoy this show and love this character if I ignore the A/R. While I certainly agree with you that there were too many unnecessary reminders of their relationship and love for each other (blech), it never felt like it was the big motivating factor for her actions, to me. She’s sacrificed so much of herself for the protection of the fleet and survival of humanity, there was no way she was going to allow Gaeta and Zarek to destroy all that. Angeli doesn’t have the light touch some of the other writers have and I think it’s a case of not trusting the audience to make the right connections and using the relationship with Adama as some sort of shorthand.

I’m still not entirely clear of Zarek’s motivations. I have to ask myself now if he ever was an idealist. Ultimately, he didn’t end up being all that different from Phelan.

I was also left to wonder if Zarek and Gaeta received the same trial that Adama was afforded. And was Romo asked to defend them? ;) Unless they both plead guilty. Gaeta might have been able to cobble together some sort of defense, but Zarek ordered the murder of eleven people.

And we'll see some bitching in the rec room as Starbuck punches Racetrack a few times and that'll serve for continuity regarding that HILARIOUS TIME she helped murder people.

Hee!

People think like Narcho. This will not change. It needs to be addressed.

It really has to be. At the very least I would expect to see more violence between the military personal as people want payback for fallen comrades, if not for the mutiny itself.

They give Roslin the big, emotional romantic moment of "OMG HE'S DEAD," about Adama. But for Adama? Yeah. Tigh. IJS.

HA! Glad you picked up on that too.

[nightxade.livejournal.com]

I'm not sure about Zarek as a civilian (though, really! O.o), but I believe Gaeta's actions, under military law, warrant execution without trial.

They give Roslin the big, emotional romantic moment of "OMG HE'S DEAD," about Adama. But for Adama? Yeah. Tigh. IJS.

HA! Glad you picked up on that too.

Wasn't Adama working under the assumption that he'd gotten Roslin safely off, so that would leave only Lee or Tigh to break him. Still, I think he totally dishonoured Tigh by giving in there. Ultimately, he acted like a little spoiled brat throughout the whole trial process, farcical as it was. Not a leader people are supposed to respect. Fine, don't give them a statement of innocence, but please, "Shove it up your ass?" Oh. The eloquence.

[asta77.livejournal.com]

I suppose an argument could be made that Zarek and Gaeta were still a threat to the fleet as long as they were alive and thus needed to be executed immediately. After all, Zarek was making plans for the mutiny from the brig.

Fine, don't give them a statement of innocence, but please, "Shove it up your ass?" Oh. The eloquence.

That was in character for Adama, but I expect better writing from the show if that makes sense. I much preferred how Baltar handled the deck being stacked against him.

[beccatoria.livejournal.com]

No, I agree, given the plot, the Quorum massacre couldn't have been the catalyst because Zarek wouldn't have admitted that to her, but it's still an interesting thought.

And oh now I'm really hoping that next week we do see her confronted with the blood everywhere (even though I doubt we will see that) because oh gods Mary McDonnell would nail that scene.

I wish I were better at ignoring A/R. I know I'd be happier if I could and I used to be much better at it. I think I'd steeled myself to deal with it, but hadn't realised quite how different canonical A/R would feel to me, or, if I'm being uncharitable, quite how hard the writers would push it. I do really hope that it's just the writer being unsubtle. I really enjoyed Laura in the last episode when she WAS all about her personal issues with Zarek and how she wasn't going to let him assume the presidency.

I think that if Gaeta was entitled to a court-martial he probably got one, and probably got a fair one, considering that mutiny in time of war is a crime that I think is punishable by execution, and he can't really mount much of a defense against that. In turn, Zarek's not military but he did order the deaths of eleven people, so it's not exactly ambiguous there either.

But one of the reasons I love the firing squad deaths is that they're so bleak. So devoid of glory. So...small. After everything, all the mutinies, all the death, all the betrayals, here is where the line ended up being drawn, and...it's all so arbitrary. I mean, yes, what happened in this mutiny was more violent and brutal than before. Yes I understand why this is the place where the line got drawn. But at the same time, the entire situation is kind of absurdist and pointless.

Zarek and Gaeta crossed a line that Adama can't uncross, and that, in fact, Adama kept right on crossing. Because there was nothing else to do and there was no going back.

And...I want to see the fallout.

[asta77.livejournal.com]

but hadn't realised quite how different canonical A/R would feel to me, or, if I'm being uncharitable, quite how hard the writers would push it. I do really hope that it's just the writer being unsubtle.

Imho, the A/R wasn't as heavyhanded in the previous episodes as it was here. Michael Angeli isn't known to be the subtlest of BSG writers. The Lee/Adama scenes in 'The Son Also Rises' drove me crazy. And he's responsible for 'The Woman King'. It's hard to believe he wrote one of my all time favorite episodes, 'Six of One'. Then again, that episode benefited from two things - being story driven and having a large portion of the Lee/Kara scene end up on the cutting room floor.

[rose-griffes.livejournal.com]

I freaked out a bit when Baltar said that line about cutting his legs off (because he had run away again). I totally blame 'The Body Is a Myth.' ;0)

[beccatoria.livejournal.com]

AHAHAHAHAHAA! OMG I totally missed that! But that's awesome. I should have made the connection. ;)

(Also I love your icon! HEE!)

[nightxade.livejournal.com]

You know what makes me saddest about Gaeta. It's not merely that he likely won't be remembered as he wishes, but that Adama will always hate him. All of Adama's children who have betrayed him have had the opportunity for redemption, but Gaeta's dead. Gone.

Not that I'm saying everyone needs redemption from Daddy. Or rather, they have the opportunity to reunite with him because he is forced to see their reasoning for what they did. If he could forgive the Sharons, he could have forgiven Gaeta in time.

[beccatoria.livejournal.com]

Good point. Adama's not exactly the forgiving type. Although he's also the self-blaming type. I can see him in future brooding over Gaeta and making it all about his failures, etc., emo, emo.

But...it's interesting that you identify Gaeta as one of Adama's surrogate sons. It's not something I had really considered before because I never saw their relationship as that familial, but I do see where you're coming from.

I don't know if Adama could have forgiven Gaeta. On the one hand, as you say, he forgave Sharon (or at least a version of her). On the other hand, he's the kind of guy who can forgive incompetance and mass-murder as long as you don't personally betray him, and he justifies the forgiveness of a lot of his surrogate children who "betrayed him" by rationalising that they thought they were doing the right thing, or that they didn't really know what they were doing and that really, they never doubted Daddy, they just got their judgement clouded.

I don't know if that rationalisation would work with Gaeta because of the obviousness with which is, well, mutinied.

Then again, this is Adama who wants to deal with all problems by glaring, muttering something about having a "pair", making a nonsensical speech about not giving his family breaks, and then having a manhug/fistfight/manhugfistfight and pretending the whole thing never happened. So you might be right.

But either way. Gaeta, man. I never particularly identified with him, but yeah. There was a line crossed there, when Adama had him executed. A line I don't think can ever get uncrossed.

[nightxade.livejournal.com]

No Gaeta's not high on the surrogate list, but I imagine he's there as part of the family as a whole. I don't expect Adama to ever have fully forgiven him like the others for the reasons you say, but I'd like to think that he could have come to at the very least grudgingly respect the why of what he did (like with Lee over Baltar). I would have liked to see Adama sitting down with Gaeta before the execution. I would have liked to see some sadness in Adama's eyes, rather than the pure hatred. :(

There was a line crossed there, when Adama had him executed. A line I don't think can ever get uncrossed.

I don't think that was a line that could have not been crossed. I'm fairly certain that Gaeta's actions warranted immediate execution and I am certain that Gaeta knew it and was prepared for it as soon as the FTLs died.

Perhaps a big arena match would be a good way to sort out the mess of who's on who's side since we don't have time for trials?

[nightxade.livejournal.com]

And also also! Nothing about Hoshi! I am a bit annoyed about that. The guy hunted for his love all that time and got nothing but a passing camera angle throughout this whole thing. I don't expect him to have made a heartfelt plea to Gaeta to stop or something, but.. at the very least, it would have been nice to see them in the brig at the end too.

[beccatoria.livejournal.com]

Yeah, this is what happens when you write the webisodes to give Gaeta extra motivation AFTER the season is over. :( Which is one of the reasons I always worried that outing Gaeta as gay or bisexual wouldn't be as awesomely equality-like as the writers seemed to think since basically they outed him in the closet of the webisodes and then the series shoved him right back in.

Although the webisode writer also said that originally the plan was to have Narcho as Gaeta's boyfriend, which would make a lot of sense given the show's plot and would have felt less like that relationship totally disappeared, but apparently the actor wasn't available so they went with Hoshi.

I like to think that Gaeta put Hoshi in the brig with the rest of the loyalists just to keep him safe when he knew people would be running around with guns and shit, but...there you have it. :(

[grav-ity.livejournal.com]

(Note: I have chosen, for the sake of my sanity, to view Racetrack laughing at Zarek's jokes as a canny bit of self-preservation on her part. Because really, if Zarek had told me a joke at that point, I would have laughed too. If only from nervous adrenaline.)

THAT KILLED ME. Seriously, it's like my shining memory from the whole damn ep. Which I adored, obviously, because I love the Old Man.

Philandering is spelt ph. :)

LOVE CALLY!!! Loved that whole scene. Love the ambiguity of the "wouldn't have mattered" (which, for the record, I think was about Cally because why would a Cylon care about having a half Cylon kid?)

My big problem with...oh, just go read my post. I am not retyping it here.

[beccatoria.livejournal.com]

I REFUSE TO BELIEVE IT WAS ANYTHING OTHER THAN A CLEVER RUSE ON RACETRACK'S PART.

Somewhat more seriously - apparently Racetrack had something of a plotline in this episode that got cut for time so maybe there would have been a better explaination for her behaviour/we'd find out whether she pulled a Kelly or a Narcho.

Philandering is spelt ph. :)

PHINE. :p (Seriously, though, I thought it looked wrong...)

Love the ambiguity of the "wouldn't have mattered" (which, for the record, I think was about Cally because why would a Cylon care about having a half Cylon kid?)

Oh, sorry, I wasn't being clear. I meant to suggest that it also applied to Nicky in that he wouldn't have cared he wasn't Nicky's father, he still loved the kid, not about his levels of cylonicity.

I guess what I mean is, we can interpret the line as a statement that he loved her so much he wouldn't have listened to Kelly because he wouldn't have believed him/would have taken the chance it wouldn't have been true this time, or we can take it to mean that even knowing everything for sure he'd do it over again. And while both are very sweet, I think the second is sweeter and choose to view it that way. Cus dude, CHIEF. AND HIS CHUBBY BABY. And now, sort of also HotDog. :/

[obsessive-a101.livejournal.com]

Hi! I hope I'm not intruding, but I've always enjoyed reading other people's thoughts/reviews of episodes, because, heck, they are usually a lot more organized than my thoughts. I love the points you raise up here.

As for Bill and Laura... I'm a shipper, yes I am (though I'm pretty much a rabid Laura Roslin fangirl LOL). And it's funny, because though MM tore my heart apart with her acting in those scenes and the facial expression, I'm being very optimistic in my reading here, I think it's interesting to note that the devastation she clearly felt at the announcement of the Admiral's execution was overshadowed in the next moment. I actually love how they show her pulling together and unleashing herself after Zarek's line about how she should surrender because it would be the best thing for the "people." The rage on her face in that moment I thought really was the entryway in everything that happens afterwards I thought, so Bill actually didn't color that scene as much as I might have thought of as a shipper. The timing of his words and her shift in expressions and body language seemed to indicate that she was angry that Zarek would even dare say that to her. That he even had the right to say that to her.

(^_^)" I don't know. Hence, my rambly, ill-written thoughts. *sighs*

[beccatoria.livejournal.com]

Hi! You're totally not intruding! :) I also like to hear other people's thoughts and reviews.

You know, I'd actually completely forgotten, in my anti-shipper-haze, that Zarek followed up his declaration that Adama was dead with an insistence that surrender was best for the people. When I rewatch I'm definitely going to keep this in mind and see if it affects my reading of the situation, so thank you for the alternate perspective.

If I can find a way to see her screaming bloody murder as anger on behalf of her people I'd just...be so relieved. Because that part of her is like, my favourite part of Laura Roslin ever (I am also a rabid fangirl!) and I just...I think my fear of losing it is part of my perhaps hasty willingness to interpret this scene in a more negative light?